No libido after PCT don't know what to do.

[Brazilianguy]

Testosterone: 510 (from 250 to 825)
Free Testosterone: 480 (until 640)
E2: 29
Prolactin: 9
DHT: 27 (from 25 to 100)
Progesterone 72 (from 20 to 90)
LH 4.5
FSH 2.5
DHEAS - 351 microg/L (from 20 to 34 years old the reference - 160 to 492)
Free T3 - 33 (from 24 to 37)
Free T4 - 1.1 (from 0.9 to 1.7)
TSH: 3.6

My symptoms are:
Low libido, ED, brain fog, low energy through the day, depression/anhedonia, low ejaculation, wattery ejaculation, low orgasm, my muscles became fat, need to urinate in 2 in 2 hours, like I can't hold it too much.

Now I'm taking proviron 50mg ED. I'm now on the 7th day on proviron and today I'm on the third day on tribulus terrestris, and I noticed my brain fog improved, my mind is more clear and I can focus more on the studies, my urinate problem improved too now I don't feel the need to urinate in 2 in 2 hours. Libido didn't change and I can't say yet if my ejaculation is more white and thick maybe (I really can't tell because I don't know) it improved like I said more white and thick.

I saw that you took androhard. And that's is one of the things you did that cured you. The first time you took androhard did you notice in the same day the first dosage an increase in your libido and well being? I'm asking it because I don't feel a difference in libido yet. Other question I took DHEA before and I felt nothing not even clear mind.

I took clomid, tamoxifen, AI, and my testosterone level before was 340 and now is 510 and felt nothing different just the number on papers changed.

I've never cycle what happened to me I think it was to strict vegan diet no meat, no eggs, a lot of soy, a lot of green tea and drugs.

[markam]

strict vegan diet no meat, no eggs, a lot of soy, a lot of green tea and drugs.

Seriously???????

[BoneDaddy]

Seriously???????

x2!

[weekend]

Ex vegan over here...

Being vegan doesn't usually kill libido. But mine was definitely enhanced when I started going meathead mode (on my first cycle of androhard lol)

How about some steak and eggs daily, mixed nuts and more clean carbs and veggies.

DHT is pretty low. And FSH is a bit low too. You might wanna try some toremifene for the FSH. It will up regulate LH indirectly as well and give you higher T levels.

[longBallLima]

how old are you? what drugs are you taking? many of them are associated with either low libido or impotence

plus being a vegan makes you unamerican and as far as i'm concerned unbrazilian, you commie!

in all seriousness, i'd be surprised if it was caused by your diet unless you didnt have enough cholesterol in your diet to metabolize testosterone, but it'd be something pretty new, at least as far as i know

[Brazilianguy]

Yes I think the soy, and the green tea (I used to drink a lot everyday to lose weight) caused my problem. Now I eat meat and other stuffs. I have this problem for 4 years now. And I returned to eat meat I think 3 years ago.

Do you guys think I'm starting improving with proviron? Until now the only thing I noticed is that I'm ejaculating more and my mind is more clear, I'm more talkative too and not feeling very tired like I used to feel everyday. Maybe I need to take it for some time to recover, someone said that just felt different when he took for 4 or 6 weeks. What do you guys think about what I said?

[Wango]

I'm also curious?

[longBallLima]

the proviron might be helpful seeing as your DHT is pretty low

[Jelisej]

You need to see good endocrinologist, you will not be able to sort problems on your own- first looks like your thyroid is failling/slowing down, you'll probably need to start adding some T4 (it seems that your t4-t3 conversion is good, so T4 only will probably work for you). Your DHT is low, and comparably progesterone is high and progesterone keeps both DHT and E2 in check, so basically your DHT activity is non-existent. Wheter your E2 level r4eadings are correct is questionable (SERM may affect this) and E2 has very improtant role for both libido and erection quality.
As for clomid- downside of clomid is that vast majority of people dont get "feel" of increased testosterone levels, almost never it increases libido- very often is quite opposite. Your LH and FSH are relatively low especially considering you have been on SERM.

So, definitely see endo, you need to do some more tests, trying to fix problem on your own is not likely to be succesfull as situation may be more complex than you may think and you'll have to address lot of things,
at some point you may try so called "clomid restart" but its unlikely that it will fix all problems (inc possible thyroid issues)
Also being vegetarian is not helping.

[Brazilianguy]

Jelisej thank you so much and the others too.

I have a few questions. First I need to say that this exame was more than 5 months after SERMS so now this is my real numbers not because I was on SERMS. SERMS improved my Total T and Free T numbers.

1 - I'm reading about estrogen dominance and how it can influence on TSH levels. Woman who takes estrogen replacement need to start T4 or increase their T4 dosage because their TSH will increase. I read that pregnant needs to take T4 sometimes because their TSH increase. The increase in TSH may be from higher progesterone or higher prolactin or higher estradiol? I'm affraid about starting taking T4 and then become dependent to it. I also saw some people taking steroids that decreased TSH and then it increased it I think I saw that Stanozolol did it.

2 - I have a good conversion from T4 to T3 that's why I don't understand why my TSH is kinda high I just can imagine that estrogens are doing it because my muscle can't get dense and hard I'm not very fat but not lean too I would say I have fatty muscles.

3 - Do you know if dostinex can decrease progesterone? I took it before and don't felt better I know that it can decrease prolactin but don't know about progesterone do you know something that can decrease progesterone?

My endocrinologist is good he can prescribe anything I want because he knows that I'm not that comon sense about steroids.
I see people getting well from all these symptoms that I have with proviron high dosage for a extent time. Other guy I saw that fixed the same problem that I have with androhard he took finasteride and nothing worked that well for him. Maybe do you think I need a good androgenic steroid to reverse these things and then do a PCT?

I saw people taking tbol and saying their libido increased.

Also I think it's a good information to give. My sperm is watery, low volume and not so white as it used to be before my low libido and ED problems. I saw that watery sperm and normal sperm has something in common with the prostate and maybe my prostate is smaller than normal (I really don't know if smaller or bigger prostate would make watery sperm) I have more to write but I prefer to receive a feedback before I write more. I already wrote a lot.

[Jelisej]

Typical sign of hypothyroidism is increasing TSH levels with decreasing T4 levels, in some people T4-T3 conversion stays good (as it seems in your case) or maybe in your case you may supplementing with some stuff that is helping conversion (adding selenium or stuff that contains it, iodine supps), in any case your bloodwork is textbook example of slowing down thyroid, if for example your t4-t3 conversion is slower, than your ft3 would be somewhat lower, your fT4 would be somewhat higher and TSH would be higher. Now, must be noted that fT3 is hormone that does most of the stuff, but fT4 also has some action, it is important for hair growth and brain function as well. In any case, at some point you will have to start thyroid medication, and it will be for life I'm afraid. State of your adrenals are inconclusive, progesterone is ok and DHEA(s) as well, but cortisol is main actor here, and we dont know is it good enough- some of symptoms you described could be from low cortisol, or it could be from combination of low thyroid output and low cortisol (adrenals and thyroid work closely together and problem in one area will affect other as well as rest of endocrine system).

I was not clear enough on progesterone in previous message- your progesterone is ok, and it does not need fixing, it just that your DHT is too low for progesterone level, so you probably have some level of "sedating effect" from progesterone (which will have negative effect on libido) and progesterone has some anti-5ar activity. So I would leave prog alone- BTW dostinex lower prolactin and to some extent growth hormone, there is only one compound that lowers progesterone and is still under research/trials AFAIK. Even DHT I would leave for last bit, supplementing proviron or anything else at the moment is not best idea, as you need more testings and you want them to be accurate.

Considering you are going to toilet so often does implicate possible problems with prostate (it can also be low aldosterone levels, or infection or neurological problem or combination), and watery sperm is sometimes cause by some fluids coming from enlarged prostate- though I'm not specialist in that area, so I would leave it to others.

So, I would suggest you to re-check your thyroid and on top of test you've done before I would add antibodies, also would check cortisol and ACTH response- if confirmed low thyroid output I would start T4 immediately, if ACTH response is not good than you will need to treat adrenals as well, if ACTH is good than you will probably be ok or you will need to boost adrenals on temporarily bases,
after 4-5 weeks you need to retest your thyroid levels and adjust medication if needed and recheck your cortisol;
fixing thyroid will reflect on testosterone levels, which I would expect to be higher- TT will definitely be higher (as your SHBG will raise) free test will hopefully not get reduced

Your lifestyle may have some effect on your DHT levels, for example green tea inhibits 5AR activity which would reduce DHT levels, plus being vegetarian etc...

[Brazilianguy]

I tried hydrocortisone, prednisone, DHEA not all at the same time but none of them gave me any result. I can sleep and wake up well. I don't have hard time to sleep or wake up.
I saw people taking trenbolone or Deca and it raised their TSH levels. I would like to avoid T4, T3 meds at all cost because is something that I see many people using and don't feeling any result from it and it starts a terrible puzzle because T3 you need to take more than twice a day, armour is hard too and some people will get crazy thyroid levels like very low TSH very high T3 and low T4.

I think when I used SERMS or AI my TSH increased I know that SERMS may increase estrogen as well but my lab is recent and I stopped SERMS and AI for a long time. I stopped being vegan and drinking green tea for a long time.

Do you know if iodine supplement could be bad for thyroid? Because I read that Lugol can make a person hypothyroid after treatment. My antibodies labwoork are Ok. I also read that pregnant sometimes needs to take thyroid medication and woman who takes estrogen will need too that's why I think I'm more estrogenic than androgenic and my thyroid increased the TSH because its strange my FT3 is good and a lot of blood tests that I see I see people with FT4 similar to mine. I'm affraid to start any thyroid medication and it becomes a bigger puzzle to me.

About the urination I've noticed I just need to urinate a lot when I masturbate a lot in the day If I don't do that I don't feel the need to urinate all the time.
I'm in a situation that I don't know what to do and each people tell me something different. One guy told me that I need my SHBG below 10. My E2 should be 10 or 15 because my testosterone is not so high comparing to E2. But all I read is that e2 below 20 is bad for libido and health and it should be 22 until 30.

What I saw is that two guys recovered from all this nightmare one took androhard V1 and V3 and after each cycle he felt better after PCT. Other guy took proviron but I really don't know the dosage because in one of his posts he said he was doing 25, 75, 150, 175mg and he said he start noticing in 4 or 6 weeks. It's really a hard thing to follow and the same guy when he was taking proviron he did a cycle with T and Deca. He also used DNP so I really don't know.

I see that these two guys have something in common, both took an androgen medication. Do you think I should try androgel? I would use it with proviron and then do a PCT. Or maybe I could use something more strong like stanozolol. My friend has the same issue but he cycled DECA and in the other cycle he used trenbolone he said he got deca dick and the other cycle trenbolone made him worse and he used in the last cycle and he said stanozolol increased his ejaculation.

[Brazilianguy]

Other thing I noticed. I'm starting to get night sweats after using proviron. It is hot where I'm living but before even when I went to the beach I didn't sweat at night. I think its a good piece of information because I saw some people relating it. Does it relates to estrogen?

[Jelisej]

Any kind of hormonal disbalance will result in nightsweats, so I cannot really comment on that.
As for thyroid and AAS, lot of AAS will affect thyroid- but on temporary bases, really- thyroid hormones, TSH is all over the place when on trenbolone- but eventually it settles back to normal. SHBG ideally is between 15-25 IMO, and E2- 25 +/- 10, depending on test levels.
Anyway, I gave you may opinion, and that is as far as I can go, I would strongly suggest you to go to endo and work with him. Good luck!

[Brazilianguy]

Jelisej I can't use words to describe how I can say thank to you.

I just watched my latest blood test is the same as the above and I just forgot to put my SHBG level to you analise. My SHBG is in 20 pg/ml.
So what do you think? Someone told me that If I have low SHBG like I have I should get my E2 close to 20 or even less?
In another forum I don't know if I can say the name here. The people say whatever is your T level you should get your E2 in 22. Other guy said that some people with low SHBG the E2 should be 15 but I don't know and I really need your help. Also I know that estrogen dominance (e2 I'm sure and I don't know about progesterone) can increase TSH even with people who has good T3 levels (as you saw my levels). Do you think its possible fix this estrogen dominance and avoid thyroid medication? I saw people lowering TSH without these meds just fixing some hormones that's why I'm asking it makes me feel hope to fix it too.

Thank you so much for your help I pray to God that he will pay you with a lot of joys.

[Jelisej]

As far as I can tell, you main problem is low resting metabolic rate- resting metabolic rate is determined by: cortisol, fT3, insulin (sensitivity) and leptin- if one or more of these are skewed it will result in low resting metabolic rate- which basically means inability to sustain high(er) levels of hormones.
So what it means is that when testosterone levels go up so goes demand for cortisol and fT3 (as resting metabolic rate need to increase) so in your particular case there is at least one issue (with thyroid- as demand for fT3 goes up thyroid struggles to produce and brain is pushing it to work harder by sending signals (TSH) but in reality thyroid cannot keep up- subsequently that results in higher aromatisation levels so E2 goes up faster than it should be, again brain detects raising E2 levels and cuts off testosterone production. Now, if you would reduce E2 by AI you would get some higher test levels but your TSH would be even higher which would result in high prolactin levels, now you can add dostinex and reduce prolactin then probably your progesterone would get too high killing your libido etc.... etc... basically in every scenario of supplementing result is similar- you can boost your libido only on temporary basis.
So, in the end best thing is to boost metabolic rate- you can stay completely natural, even if your TT stays around 500 you still should be ok, your libido, workouts etc will not be great but they should be decent- you need to adjust your training and listen your body, sleep well, avoid stress, stimulants... Not overtraining, avoiding stress, stimulants, getting enough sleep will help adrenals, avoiding high GI carbs combined with exercise should improve insulin sensitivity, add 200 mcg selenium for thyroid (or you may get it from raw food like nuts) after 5-6 weeks add some iodine (I recommend lugol)- also make sure you get enough vitamin d.
All this can be helpful, after few months you'll see if there is any improvement. If situation is still not good than you will have to consider medication, tough even if things work out, still medication seems inevitable at some point in future.

As for E2 and SHBG- this is bit tricky as in reality we know whats driving something up or down, rarely we can manipulate them- people with low SHBG usually stay on low-ish side and with high on higher end.
Increase SHBG- Anabolic hormones generally reduce SHBG. These include testosterone, DHEA, insulin, DHT, and growth hormone.
Decrease SHBG- Thyroid hormone, Estrogens, and Progesterone (by increasing estrogen receptors/sensitivity), increase SHBG.

[Brazilianguy]

Jelisej I think I have a new information to you maybe you can help me with this too.
This is my test before SERMS.

Total T 340 min 241 max 827
SHBG 20 ...min 13 max 71
Free T 8.96 ....min 3,4 max 24,6
Bio T Avaliable 209....min 82 max 626
LH 4,2....min 1,5 max 9,3
TSH 2.4
T3 94....min 70 max 220
T4 7,4....min 5,1 max 13,5
Prolactin 6.80 min 2.10 max 17.70

Unfortunatelly I don't have my E2 levels and any other level to check. But do you think since my prolactin increased my estradiol increased to 29 now? I mean. Do you think my E2 levels were lower?

I'm asking it because the first time I took tamoxifen (novaldex) I started to get morning wood that time, also random erections through the day, more energy and one day I had a normal libido. But then I lost it all. And the next blood test I had:

Testosterone: 998
Free Testosterone: 910
SHBG: 23
E2: 38
Prolactin: 12
TSH: 3.6 (Increased from 2.4)
T4: 1.1

I don't know what happened in the days I was getting well. Do you think my e2 started to increase and getting similar to my SHBG level? Because I read in some places one guy pmgamer, his name is Phillip he told me that there's no such thing as e2 levels are optimal in 22 and e2 should follow SHBG he said his SHBG is always between 18 and 20. He just feels good when his e2 is between 15 and 20.

As I'm writing it I started to think that maybe my estrogens increased in this time and that's why my TSH increased maybe lowering then my TSH can decrease again and maybe when I get my e2 similar to my SHBG like 20 I start to feel the same thing I felt when I was on SERMS. What do you think?

I'm really grateful for all the help you're giving me.

[Jelisej]

That guy Phillipe is more-less right, but there is always personal factor, some people feel better with E2 around 20 some around 30, and SHBG should reflect E2 but it does not in many cases, and is a tricky bit as SHBG in reality depends on many factors- in your scenario I pretty much described it last time what happens- your thyroid cannot follow higher levels of testosterone as you can see your T4 goes in drain, and TSH goes up trying to dictate thyroid to make more. I may be wrong, but IMO I think your body can produce a lot, as you can see from results with tamoxifen, but ti does not as it tries to keep hormones in equilibrium, and with insufficient thyroid hormones you cannot have decent libido.
I think you have 2 options- stay natural improve lifestyle and settle for mediocre (till it lasts) or simply make appointment with endo and start with T4 medications and see what happens- tough you need to be alert regarding adrenal gland, as if it crashes you'll start all over again but from worst position.
BTW hormones should be treated in following order: 1. Adrenals 2. Thyroid 3. Sex hormones 4. GH

[Brazilianguy]

Sometimes my T4 gets 1.2 in the lab and my T3 conversion is also good. I tried everything about adrenals. HC, prednisone, Licorice Root, DHEA. I don't feel any difference when I take this things.

The time I noticed something was the first time I took the novaldex. I started to get morning wood, random erections through the day, better ejaculation and libido increased but then I lose everything again. Then my TSH, estradiol, prolactin, free testosterone, total testosterone increased. I will paste what I've found and something Phillip told me. I'd like your opinion about the ideia that decreasing estradiol would be good for thyroid levels. I asked him if decreasing e2 the prolactin would decrease too and maybe thyroid should improve. That's what he answered.

"I never heard of taking Arimidex will decrease prolactin but getting E2 in the right range can help with Thyroid levels."

This is also what I've found searching about SHBG/E2 ratio.

"E2 levels the best level
for E2 if your SHBG is mid range is 20 pg/ml. If your SHBG is lower
like mine at say 20 or less you need to keep your E2 levels lower.

What causes HighE2 and high SHBG? It seems that when my SHBG is high,
around 50 at the minute then my E2 needs to be around 50 pg/ml to get
strong nocturnal and morning wood.


Is there anyway to lower SHBG and E2 at the same time. At the moment this is my sweet spot.



Today my SHBG is between 18 to 22 and I keep my E2 levels at about 15 to 20 pg/ml.
The idea that optimal e2 equals 15-25 is indeed bogus.


A) its highly individual

B) i find that optimal e2 for me is when it closely matches shbg.


For example when my shbg is 35 i need e2 about 33-36


But when my shbg is 25 then i need 23-26

Because of your low shbg you will have alot of free E2 circulating in
your body,because shbg not only binds with free test but with free E2,

so the solution to your problem is to get your E2 lower.A good rule of
thumb is if your shbg is 15 then your e2 should be 15.If your shbg is 30
then your e2 should be 30.I myself have a very low shbg of 9.9 and have
to keep my e2 around 10.


Yes i read about it on another forum and decided to try it myself cause i
wasnt feeling good,had all the symptoms of high e2 but my e2 was only
25 but i felt like crap,so i decided to lower e2 some more and it
worked,better mood,good morning wood and no more getting emotional.Thats
why its important to know your shbg levels,that way you can try to tune
up your e2 to the desired level.

If your shbg is really low you might want to try a low dose sub-q shot
every other day.THat means less e2 conversion.Also shbg binds free test
but also free e2,so if shbg is low you will have alot of free e2
floating around in your blood stream.

(This one his SHBG is 55 and E2 55)

I feel better - am more positive, good morning wood, can concentrate
better and am seeing some body recomposition that is favorable.
I don't know whether to be worried about the higher E2 levels or not - I
don't feel emotional (feel more testosterone effects - dominance etc) ,
have good libido, nocturnal erections, no gyno signs, so no outward
signs of problems with E2."

[Jelisej]

I tend to agree to what other guys said, but I would repeat my earlier statement that controlling SHBG is almost impossible task, on other hand E2 is something that is possible to deal with- and there I would always go with the symptoms, I 100 % agree with idea of sweet spot (regarding E2).
As for E2- thyroid relationship- E2 does interfere with thyroid hormones, for example women need higher thyroid levels than men, man with thyroid hormones on 50% of ref range will feel ok, on other hand most of women will already have some symptoms of low thyroid output. Men with low thyroid hormones will have harder time to cope with high E2 levels, and will probably suffer from panic attacks. Reducing E2 will take off some pressure of thyroid, but wheter hormone levels will increase, not sure but I dont think it will make significant effect.

Back to SHBG and E2, with low SHBG person will aromatise a lot and will need more AI to control E2, on other hand person with SHBG will tolerate higher E2 levels and will aromatise less, but will have more difficulties with free test levels as well. Generally, lot of people who had high SHBG went on TRT regardless of having good tot. testosterone levels- even guys with 800-850-ng/dl, as tot. testost. cannot cross brain-blood-barrier, and thus we cannot "feel" effect of it.

[nate3993]

Interesting u back nolvadex.....I seem to remember u saying in the past that Nolva was kind of weak and either Clomid or torem should be the go to.

[Jelisej]

Interesting u back nolvadex.....I seem to remember u saying in the past that Nolva was kind of weak and either Clomid or torem should be the go to.

I'm not sure which post you are referring to; you probably misread something.

[nate3993]

This was a while back....maybe it was someone else...seems that most people on here either use Clomid or torem and very few use Nolva. But I had thought the general consensus was that Nolva was meh as a test booster...also...I hardly see you or others rec. Nolva...almost always torem or Clomid...I guess just my own perceived observations?

[Brazilianguy]

Other thing I'd like to know does the need to urinate a lot through the day is related to high e2/enlarged prostate or to low aldosterone? Because I think I read that lower urine flow and the desire to urinate a lot is relate to enlarged prostate and high estradiol will have negative effects on the prostate.

Also my prolactin increased and I read that prolactin follows E2 if E2 increase the prolactin will increase too.
When I took SERMS I had TSh 2.4 a lot of people would say I was hypothyroid but I felt fine about 4 days with libido, energy, morning and random wood.
I'm not sure but I think the SERMS increased my Total Testosterone but also increased my E2 and prolactin and they didn't decrease since then also my TSH increased it makes me think that happened an increase of estrogens in my body leading more TSH.

I don't want to change my SHBG (20) levels I think they are fine and my free testosterone is also good. I just wanna see if decreasing my e2 from 29 to 20 or less will increase my libido, energy, start my morning wood and see if will impact my thyroid too.

My friend has the same problem his TSH increased and his prolactin now is always between 17 or 22 I don't know where is his SHBG but his TSH is a little bit higher than mine he has 4.8 but his prolactin is also higher than mine. Do you think high prolactin can also change the TSH?

[Jelisej]

This was a while back....maybe it was someone else...seems that most people on here either use Clomid or torem and very few use Nolva. But I had thought the general consensus was that Nolva was meh as a test booster...also...I hardly see you or others rec. Nolva...almost always torem or Clomid...I guess just my own perceived observations?

I used SERM twice, both tamoxifene. Reason why I recommend clomid most of time is pure politics, main reason is clomid has more studies behind so its more reassuring to people and makes my life easier. Also some people have fears of cancer from tamoxifene, which I think is overrated big time. This is also one of reasons why doctors rarely prescribe tamoxifene. In reality- both compounds are very similar, really. Toremifene I dont mention as I dont have enough info etc...

[Jelisej]

When hippotalamus is sending signals to pituary to make more thyroid hormones, pituary makes TSH and along TSH prolactin gets made as well- more TSH more prolactin.
When you used SERMS at first you enjoyed it, but then you body was not able to sustain higher hormone levels becase low resting metabolic rate- and this is why it went sideways. I explained that earlier and basically you need to improve your resting metabolic rate.

As for frequent urinating it could be lot of stuff, its impossible for me to determine it. If your prostate is enlarged than its pressing down on your bladder and thus reducing its capacity, it could be low aldosterone- tough very likely you would have low blood pressure as well, thirst (as your body would be unable to hold water) or sometimes you can even have swollen face as body is desperate to hold onto water.
It can be neurological or stress related, or infection or maybe you dont tolerate something well- for example if I have energy drink with lot of caffeine I piss every few minutes.

[Brazilianguy]

Jelisej I'm thinking about to use arimidex to see if I can get a better T/E2 ratio.
When I was on SERMS I was taking 0.5mg twice a week but my E2 got 30 and before it was 38. The best number I could achieve was 29 or 27. But Phil told me that my SHBG needs a better E2 like 15 - 20.

Do you know how can I use arimidex the best protocol for it I know it is very individual but I mean when I start to get a better libido and morning wood should I just stop taking it or reduce the dosage/frequency?

Do you know any vitamin that could help with the e2 balance? Because I would like to tapper off of arimidex and not taking anything for the rest of my life.

I also have eye floaters since I got all this problems do you think it could be from high E2?

Thank you so much

[Brazilianguy]

My latest thyroid test I did it last week. I was just using proviron and tribulus.
The interesting is that my thyroid hormones came like the first blood test I did when I got these problems. But I also had low testosterone and prolactin (I will try to do another blood test with more information) and then I took tamoxifen and Vitamin E (1000iu) and then my morning wood came back, random erections, more libido, energy etc.


TSh: 2.4 (decreased)
T4 livre: 1.1
T3 livre: 0.34 (0,20 a 0,40)
RT3: 0,3 (0.1 a 0,35) ng/ml

I read that zinc deficiency can cause thyroid problems, higher estrogen, lower testosterone, maybe even increasing RT3 (I need to search more about it) and one sign of zinc deficiency is white signs in the nails I have some of these signs. Do you think if I supplement zinc I could see an even better thyroid results, libido, morning wood etc? I also read that zinc is what helps the body to produce more white semen fluid. My semen is wattery and more transparent.

[Jelisej]

I explained, very clearly what I think that problem was. I may be wrong, thats why is good to see someone who is trained and certified to deal with these problems, i can only give you some directions. Wheter you are deficient in zinc only blood test can tell you, supplementing yourself can sometimes do more harm than good- if you add one vitamin and mineral than it can lead to deficiency in some other, some minerals need others to work, some dont work well with others etc- its always best to get minerals/vitamins from diet...

Eye floaters can be caused by many things- it is one of sides that sometimes happen with SERMS, especially if person was taking high doses.

Best thing to control E2 is first if possible prevent underlying cause that is causing aromatisation, or maybe reducing xenoestrogens from diet, if not than sometimes eating some green foods helps it, if not than best to take AI, preferably aromasin.

[Brazilianguy]

Jelisej why some people when they take arimidex they feel joint pain, no libido, even more dificulty to get it up.
I'm taking very high dosage of arimidex and I'm sure my estradiol is 0 now. But I don't get the side effects like joint pain, and no erection.

I saw one guy that had the same thing even with high dosage of arimidex he didn't change his puffy nipples and didn't have joint pain. But when he took androhard with arimidex he felt libido increase, no ED, but the arimidex dosage was high and then he felt the joint pain and then the libido and ED issues.

What I don't understand is that proviron is DHT but it don't make you dry like androhard can do also there are many others DHT steroids that can make it. Why that happened even if both raise DHT they do different stuffs in our body?

[Jelisej]

Naturally, it is very, very unlikely that person will have too high DHT levels, it may be on high level (tough I'm pretty sure its rare) but body can convert DHT easily to some of the (less active) metabolites and I think it can then expel them as well (via sweat, urine, etc) and I beleive with proviron is the same case and that is one of reasons that with proviron you cant really build mass.
With other DHT derivatives you can have similar or different scenario as they convert to different stuff, really. And it also depends on enzymes of person using it, plus receptors "refresh rate", levels of desensitations etc...

Joint pain on arimidex and other AI is common thing but does not always present itself, sometimes person can have clicky joints or bones etc... Taking vitamin d can prevent or reduce pain, and maybe you're getting lot of it, also if you have source of xenoestrogens (plastic) which act as estrogens in body AI will not have effect on them.
Also painfull joints can be sign of low cortisol level.

Generally, symptoms of low and high E2 can be difficult do distinguish, and neither option is good. Lowering E2 can result of lowering of bone density, and usually spine is the first victim. Never keep E2 too low, and preferably use exemestane/aromasin asit does not have rebound effect, and also if too low, estrogen levels dont take too long to return to "normal" and it happens gradually, while on arimidex one can be on emotional rollercoaster.

[alexwatt]

Now libido problem can be treated well the medications which are widely used around the globe to come out sexual health like erectile dysfunction, low libido. Medications like generic viagra online (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/generic-viagra.html), kamagra jelly (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/kamagra-jelly.html), kamagra soft tabs (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/kamagra-soft-tabs.html) are used by the peoples who facing to such problem of health.

[Freepressright]

Now libido problem can be treated well the medications which are widely used around the globe to come out sexual health like erectile dysfunction, low libido. Medications like generic viagra online (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/generic-viagra.html), kamagra jelly (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/kamagra-jelly.html), kamagra soft tabs (http://www.royalpharmacy.net/kamagra-soft-tabs.html) are used by the peoples who facing to such problem of health.

Viagra doesn't do anything to fix libido. It will not make you have a sex drive. It only aids with blood flow to your penis.

Low libido has a cause, and it isn't a Viagra deficiency.

[johnmasterio]

[Freepressright]

Herbals:

Pine Pollen Tincture or Powder (at Superman Herbs)
Tongkat Ali Powder (at Superman Herbs)
Tribulus 90% by Liftmode
Liquid Boron
Ashwagandha

All these can promote the desire to have sex. Viagra and Cialis do nothing for desire. They merely make it easier for blood to flow into and stay in the penis. They don't promote excitement.

[Cobalt]

X2 on the big V and C not promoting desire. I had a medication just destroy my desire recently and I started taking tadafil to try and help. All it did was make me wake up with raging boners.

That is an interesting list FPR. I actually picked up some Tribulus and Boron today to give them a try. I kept hearing about the two, and coming from you just confirms it.

[entropy]

X2 on the big V and C not promoting desire. I had a medication just destroy my desire recently and I started taking tadafil to try and help. All it did was make me wake up with raging boners.

That is an interesting list FPR. I actually picked up some Tribulus and Boron today to give them a try. I kept hearing about the two, and coming from you just confirms it.

Check out some of cdnuts posts bro. Had the same sorta problems a few months back and between fpr's and cdnuts posts my libido has been crazy high for a while noe.

[nate3993]

Cialis gives me more desire.

[Cobalt]

Check out some of cdnuts posts bro. Had the same sorta problems a few months back and between fpr's and cdnuts posts my libido has been crazy high for a while noe.

Already feeling a difference after switching off the meds, but I'm reading up on everything and taking some stuff to boost the desire back to where it was. Stupid side effects, pisses me off.

[entropy]

Already feeling a difference after switching off the meds, but I'm reading up on everything and taking some stuff to boost the desire back to where it was. Stupid side effects, pisses me off.

Tell me about it bro. Prescription poisons. Hope you feel great again soon, your log is a pretty awesome read.

[Jelisej]

Herbals:

Pine Pollen Tincture or Powder (at Superman Herbs)
Tongkat Ali Powder (at Superman Herbs)
Tribulus 90% by Liftmode
Liquid Boron
Ashwagandha
All these can promote the desire to have sex. Viagra and Cialis do nothing for desire. They merely make it easier for blood to flow into and stay in the penis. They don't promote excitement.

Apparently pine pollen contains testosterone (and some other androgens), and that makes wonder if that testosterone gets to our bloodstream, and if it has any effect on HPTA?

[tallstraw]

^no way, any negligible amount should be destroyed by our stomach, correct?

[entropy]

^no way, any negligible amount should be destroyed by our stomach, correct?

Sublingual would work though? I think a lot of people use tinctures.

[5 alpha victim]

Sublingual would work though? I think a lot of people use tinctures.


Based on what I'm reading at the superman herb website the pine pollen tincture extract is better than the pine pollen powder for getting the hormonal fix.

Its clear the powder still has hormonal benefits but it looks like it's used more for a superfood that contains tons of good stuff. Thats more or less what the guys on the podcast I listened to our saying as well.

So maybe this is y the powder is the better sup to take every day and the tincture is the better sup to throw into a natural T boosting cycle of some sort? The only other thought I have is that I noticed the tincture is listed in the list of herbs to cycle on the other thread while it's being recommended to take the powder every day.

[Freepressright]

Based on what I'm reading at the superman herb website the pine pollen tincture extract is better than the pine pollen powder for getting the hormonal fix.

Its clear the powder still has hormonal benefits but it looks like it's used more for a superfood that contains tons of good stuff. Thats more or less what the guys on the podcast I listened to our saying as well.

So maybe this is y the powder is the better sup to take every day and the tincture is the better sup to throw into a natural T boosting cycle of some sort? The only other thought I have is that I noticed the tincture is listed in the list of herbs to cycle on the other thread while it's being recommended to take the powder every day.

You guys are both correct based on my research of the matter. The tincture concentrates the actives/androgens so that they can be delivered under the tongue. I would probably be inclined to use the powder as my superfood and the tincture for my hormone therapy.

[Freepressright]

Cialis gives me more desire.

Regularly-dosed Cialis probably will, or can, now that I think more about it. It actually has pro-testosterone properties, believe it or not, or so I remember reading.

But if you're on cycle, especially on a 19nor or something potent, you wouldn't realize its pro-test properties.