Latest tests

[ToniBR]

Latest bloods: glicemic an insulin curve

Fasting 10 hours: 95,0 [70 - 99] mg/nl 5,5 [2,6 - 24,9] µU/mL

75g of glucose

30 min after: 169,0 mg/dL 49,3 µU/mL

60 min after: 147,0 mg/dL 78,2 µU/mL

120 min after: 76,0 mg/dL 47,6 µU/mL

Any input? All seems normal?

[weekend]

interesting that your 120 min post glucose is lower than your fasted glucose.

seems like sleep made your glucagon go up bigtime.

[ToniBR]

interesting that your 120 min post glucose is lower than your fasted glucose.

seems like sleep made your glucagon go up bigtime.

I'm doing intermitent fasting. Don't know how much that could've affected.

[ToniBR]

I TRANSLATED EVERYTHING I COULD


HEMOGRAM

Eritrócitos: 4,97 [4,5 - 6,1] milhões/mm³

Hemoglobina: 15,6 [12,8 - 17,8] g/dL

Hematócrito: 46 [37,0 - 53,0] %

VCM 93,6 [80,0 - 100,0] fL

HCM 31,4 [25,0 - 35,0] pg

CHCM 33,5 [31,0 - 37,0] g/dL

RDW 12,0 [11,5 - 14,5] %

Leucócitos 6470 [3600 - 11000]/uL

Neutrófilos 50,3 % 3230 [1500 - 7000]/uL

Eosinófilos 2,6 % 170 [0 - 600]/uL

Basófilos 0,3 % 20 [0 - 200]/uL

Monócitos 10,5 % 680 [100 - 1200]/uL

Linfócitos 36,3 % 2350 [1000 - 4500]/uL

Platelets 156000 mm³ [150.000 - 450.000] mm³


VSG: 2 mm [ >15 mm]

FRIBRINOGEN: 265 [220 - 496] mg/dL

FERRITIN: 463,3 [30 - 400] ng/mL

HEMOGLOBINA GLICADA (HbA1C): 5,0 [ < 5,7%]

TOTAL COLESTEROL: 154,0 mg/dL [< 200 GOOD - LIMIT 200 - 239 - HIGH > = 240]

HDL: 56,0 [ > 40 mg/dL]

TRIGLICERIDES: 33,0 [GOOD < 150 LIMIT 150 - 199 HIGH 200 - 499 VERY HIGH > 500] mg/dL

LDL: 91,4 [GOOD <100 LIMIT 100 - 160 HIGH 160] mg/dL

CREATININ: 1,20 [0,66 - 1,25] mg/dL

UREA: 40,0 [19 - 43] mg/dL

URIC ACID: 3,8 [3,5 - 8,5] mg/dL

SODIUM: 140 [137 - 145] mmol/L

POTASSIUM: 4,3 [3,5 - 5,1] mmol/L

MAGNESIUM: 2,0 [1,6 - 2,3] mg/dL

CALCIUM: 9,50 [8,4 - 10,2] mg/dL

FOSFATASE ALCALINA: 45,0 [38 - 126] U/L

ALBUMIN: 4,1 [3,5 - 5,0] g/dL

TOTAL PROTEINS: 6,90 [6,3 - 8,2] g/dL

AMILASE: 75,0 [30 - 110] U/L

LIPASE: 48,0 [23 - 300] U/L

TGO/AST: 26,0 [17 - 59] U/L

TGP/ALT: 29,0 [21 - 72] U/L

GAMA-GT: 25,0 [15 - 73] U/L

CREATINA FOSFOQUINASE FRAÇÃO MB (CPK-MB) 8,0 [< 16] U/L

C REACTIVE PROTEIN ULTRA SENSITIVE: <0,15 mg/L [< 5,0] mg/L

BILIRRUBIN- TOTAL AND FRACTIONS

Bilirrubina Total : 1,1 [0,2 - 1,3] mg/dL
Bilirrubina direct : 0,2 [<0,3] mg/dL
Bilirrubina Indirect : 0,9 [1,1] mg/dL

FOLIC ACID: 9,8 [4,6 - 18,7] ng/mL

25 - HIDROXI VITAMIN D: 30,5 [>30] ng/mL

VITAMIN B12: 748,6 [191 - 663] pg/mL

THIS IS WHERE IT STARTS TO GET WEIRD


TSH: 1,01 [0,51 - 4,30]µUI/mL

FREE T4: : 1,42 [0,93 - 1,70] ng/dL

FREE T3: 2,21 [2,0 - 4,4] pg/mL

T3: 65,3 [80 - 200] ng/dL


FSH: 2,21 [1,50 - 12,4] mUI/mL

LH: 3,8 [1,7 - 8,6] mUI/mL

17- BETA ESTRADIOL (E2): 41,04 [7,63 - 42,6] pg/mL

TESTOSTERONE TOTAL: 428,8 [280 - 800] ng/dL

FREE T : 11,24 [3,17 - 19,04] ng/dL
BIOAVAILABLE T : 263,62 [80,7 - 447,1] ng/dL
SHBG: 20,6 [14,5 a 48,4] nmol/L

PSA: 0,843 [< 1,40] ng/mL

HEPATITIS ANTI BODIES ALL NEGATIVE

SDHEA: 522,2 [160,0 - 449,0] µg/dL

ACTH: 23,7 [7,2 - 63,3] pg/mL

PTH: 25,6 [4,0 - 65,0] pg/mL

APOLIPOPROTEÍNA A1: 144,9 [104 - 202] mg/dL

APOLIPOPROTEÍNA B: 79,0 [66 - 133] mg/dL

REUMATOID FACTOR: <10,0 [< 14,0] UI/mL

HOMOCISTEINA: 7,35 [6 - 14] umol/L

PHOSPHOR: 4,5 [2,5 - 4,5] mg/dL

[weekend]

your t3 is low from dieting most likely

testosterone isnt the greatest, hematocrit on lower end, go for some more eggs and cruciferous veggies, get some sun.

[Jelisej]

ferritin is too high- now that is first thing to look at- did you measure that before and what were results?
E2 is way to high...

Thyoid seems ok, fT3 and fT4 are okay; T3 levels depends a lot of to level of protein it gets attached (like tot test and shbg)

Total testosterone is low, SHBG is in right position but is high compared to total testosterone levels which can cause problems in future,

your vitamin d is low which is also connected to low phosphate (phosphorus).

not enough data regarding your adrenals, but I've got feeling that there are functioning ok

you are supplementing vitamin b?

Function fo your kidney is another area that may be not performing well, or it can be one result off, or you exercised heavily night before tests?

Overall, not a great results but at least it gives you a room for improvement.
This is my first impresion, I'll look at your test again when I get more time...

[ToniBR]

I dont have older bloods of ferriting, but I'll look into that. There are many other results still to come.

I feel like my metabolism is slow and I'm having gyno symptoms.
I've been lifting daily, but nothing to extreme. I think I took the day off before the exams.


How about that high b12? I'm not taking supplements.

Thanks, guys! I have more test on the adrenals panel comming. Reverse T3, cortisol, IGF, progesterone, cortisol, dht and a couple others. I'll post them when they come, thanks for now.

I'm actually happy that these tests showed something, otherwise I would just think I got a very misterious disease.

[Jelisej]

I cannot remeber what high b12 exactly means, but I know that it can be symptomas ov some serious issues

ferritin is also thing to check for, it carries lot of sides including lowering of testosterone, low libido etc....

E2 is high and that can cause lot of problem, it would also definitely hamper you sex drive and erections, affect mood and can cause nipple sensitivity, even gyno if it stays too long,
but at the moment I would forget about sex hormones, and concentrate on general health as you could potentially have some underlying condition that could cause lot problems.

[ToniBR]

I'm confused, don't know where to go from here. Most doctors dismissed me, only an orthomolecular gave enough attention to order these.
Any suggestions of what king of doctor I should look for?

[silverstrand]

I'm confused, don't know where to go from here. Most doctors dismissed me, only an orthomolecular gave enough attention to order these.
Any suggestions of what king of doctor I should look for?

Holistic doctors practicing functional medicine, thats what I'm aiming for.

[Jelisej]

I'm confused, don't know where to go from here. Most doctors dismissed me, only an orthomolecular gave enough attention to order these.
Any suggestions of what king of doctor I should look for?

Well, I guess you need to start fom doctor of general practice, I dont really know what all this results mean, why is you ferritin high- it could be "metabolic syndrome", maybe something with your intestines or kidney problem or some other inflammation, and high b12 also suggest similar- it could all be just "one of those things", but its better to be cautious.

Anyway, after these results we can conclude that there is indeed lot of work to be done, and problems to be sorted and doing so should result in considerable improvement of your general wellbeing.

[ToniBR]

Should I continue lifting? I think the first thing I'm gonna do is increase my water intake drastically.

CORTISOL morning: 28,1 [6,2 - 19,4] µg/dL

[ToniBR]

Quick update.

Talked to a doctor today. He said my insulin and glucose are spiking too high and that might lead to future diabetes (runs in the family). He also said that the high cortisol in blunting the insulin action, so I'll need to follow some kind o diet to address that (still don't know which one). My thyroid is optimal either, with cortisol problably blocking the action of the hormones and producing too much reverse t3.

Funny enough I have some of my libido back and good erections, but still very fatigated a HUGE brain fog. Also muscle wastage, cold, pot belly digestion issues, anxiety, insomnia...

[Jelisej]

I think there is more to that than what your doc says, but what its impossible to say- cortisol, thyroid and some other hormone levels looks like body is tryinhg to fight something off (or at least it looks to me like that), one of the mechanism when body is under some kind of illness, infection etc is to reduce t3 (and hence metabolic rate) in order to slow down damage, also very often body uses cortisol to fight of infections but high cortisol later has downsides, among other it reduces testosterone levels etc,
another possibility is that your adrenal gland is secreting cortisol or/and other hormones (like adrenal hyperplasia, or small benign tumor secretin cortisol) which would also have cascading effect, for example both low and high cortisol will cause excessive aromatisation (which then lowers testosterone).
in any case further investigation is needed

not surprised that you have brain fog and are fatigued, the fact that you have some libido and good erection is nice surprise, if evertying is sorted you should improve in all these areas.

As conclusion, I would say at the moment effort should be directed towards genereal health, and hormones should be dealt with afterwards, tough I would expect lot of will improve by that time by itself.

[ToniBR]

I think there is more to that than what your doc says, but what its impossible to say- cortisol, thyroid and some other hormone levels looks like body is tryinhg to fight something off (or at least it looks to me like that), one of the mechanism when body is under some kind of illness, infection etc is to reduce t3 (and hence metabolic rate) in order to slow down damage, also very often body uses cortisol to fight of infections but high cortisol later has downsides, among other it reduces testosterone levels etc,
another possibility is that your adrenal gland is secreting cortisol (like adrenal hyperplasia, or small benign tumor secretin cortisol) which would also have cascading effect, for example both low and high cortisol will cause excessive aromatisation (which then lowers testosterone).
in any case further investigation is needed

not surprised that you have brain fog and are fatigued, the fact that you have some libido and good erection is nice surprise, if evertying is sorted you should improve in all these areas.

As conclusion, I would say at the moment effort should be directed towards genereal health, and hormones should be dealt with afterwards, tough I would expect lot of will improve by that time by itself.

Thanks, man. I already checked for hepatitis and hiv, all came back negative. Next step will be pathogen and parasites.

I think I have some libido and good erections because I always took good care of my body and maybe the defense mechanisms are still working good. I'm afraid that the long term stress burn them out.

Could it be the Finasteride caused such a stress that got me stuck in this loop? I surely freaked out when I found propecia help and that was a huge stress load, and the reduction in my ability to handle stress caused by propecia inhibition of key hormones and neurotransmitters might have aggravated it. Just theory, of course.

Well, I'll do my best here. Wait for the last tests, keep my diet clean with low GI carbs and remove possible allergenic foods. Might try to test for those too.

Thanks for now

[Jelisej]

Your plan seems good, wheter and how much of these problems are because of propecia- I dont know but I suspect that main culprit is somewhere else, and there is a big chance that most of propecia sides are gone by now;
what main problem is again I dont know, it looks to me that like your adrenal gland is secreting some hormones on its own (adrenal hyperplasia), but thats just my guess...
to me looks like your insulin/glucose is borderline, but you're still on "normal" side- your exercise and effort at keeping good diet definitely pays off, keep it going
and hpeflly you'll came across a good doc who will figure it out.

[ToniBR]

Your plan seems good, wheter and how much of these problems are because of propecia- I dont know but I suspect that main culprit is somewhere else, and there is a big chance that most of propecia sides are gone by now;
what main problem is again I dont know, it looks to me that like your adrenal gland is secreting some hormones on its own (adrenal hyperplasia), but thats just my guess...
to me looks like your insulin/glucose is borderline, but you're still on "normal" side- your exercise and effort at keeping good diet definitely pays off, keep it going
and hpeflly you'll came across a good doc who will figure it out.

My doctor works with bodybuilders and does hrt himself, so I might be in good hands. He also recognizes the importance of gut health and balance, so that is a plus. No wonder he asked for such extensive blood tests, something the most pfs sufferers never do.

My doctor did kid me saying that I had hulk's adrenals, but I hope they are just overworking and not congenital too big. I heard the dexamethasone treatment can actually slow them down, is that correct? Of course I'm not stupid to start taking such a powerful drug without proper assistance and monitoring, I'm just evaluating my options.

My gyno is still getting bigger. I had it previously from a steroid cycle, but now it's really awesome. Women are actually looking at me and feeling jealous. I tried to reverse it once with arimidex, letrozole and even exemestane with no success and even worsening while on the drug, even having all the sides of low estrogen. How is this even possible? Does that shines a light on any other underlying problem? Of course this is no concern right now, I can simply do a surgery once all this is over, but anyway I wonder...

Jelisej, if there is a heaven your place there is secure,
man. Lol. Thanks again, I'll post if anything new happens.

[Jelisej]

Dexamethasone is a dangerous stuff, sometimes some endos use it to test adrenal function, in normal patients it causes supression of adrenals (similar to pituary reaction when adding testosterone) with people with hyperplasia it does not (as its secretion is basically out of control of pituary)... And when these dexamethasone test are carried usually people feel very ill, sometimes they faint... So, definitely you dont want to mess with that,
as for gyno as I said earlier- your E2 is too high and thats main reason, and your hulks adrenals do play role in that (high aromatisation) also progesterone can raise prolactin that can cause bit more sensitivity and even milk execretion; only permanant solution there is surgery, really.
In mean time you may need to control E2, maybe even prolactin- but it needs to be done with cooperation with your doctor, otherwise it can alter blood results, misguide everyone and point all research in wrong direction, so you basically end up chasing your own tail (as lot of people do).
patience is your friend, especially now that you're on a right track.

[ToniBR]

Dexamethasone is a dangerous stuff, sometimes some endos use it to test adrenal function, in normal patients it causes supression of adrenals (similar like when adding testosterone) with people with hyperplasia it does not (as its secretion is basically out of control of pituary)... And when these dexamethasone test are carried usually people feel very ill, sometimes they faint... So, definitely you dont want to mess with that,
as for gyno as I said earlier- your E2 is too high and thats main reason, and your hulks adrenals do play role in that (high aromatisation) also progesterone can raise prolactin that can cause bit more sensitivity and even milk execretion; only permanant solution there is surgery, really.
In mean time you may need to control E2, maybe even prolactin- but it needs to be done with cooperation with your doctor, otherwise it can alter blood results, misguide everyone and point all research in wrong direction, so you basically end up chasing your own tail (as lot of people do).
patience is your friend, especially now that you're on a right track.

Sorry, my cellphone posted the same response twice and I could not see your last post. Do you mean that adding testosterone can actually lower my adrenals output?

Well, I won't be stupid to try to reverse my gyno with drugs. Been there, done that and only ended up worse. My prolactin is actually in the lower end, which actually surprised me. Maybe that's why I still have some libido?

I get to tell you, man, I'm really scared. Those studies finding overexpressed androgen receptors in people with PFS makes me wonder... Can I have that from two pills? Could the past use os steroids helped with that? Is there a way out? I don't understand much about this receptors thing. Just want to be healthy again and enjoy the little things in life. Sometimes I think that if I ever recover life will be like being on a very potent happyness drug. Sorry about the emotional post, it's been very hard to me. Thanks for the support.

[Jelisej]

"Do you mean that adding testosterone can actually lower my adrenals output? "
Actually, I did not express myself well, I edited that text.

"I get to tell you, man, I'm really scared. Those studies finding overexpressed androgen receptors in people with PFS makes me wonder... Can I have that from two pills? Could the past use os steroids helped with that? Is there a way out? I don't understand much about this receptors thing."

Cannot give you defintive and answer to that, probably no one can, but past is a past- you need to deal with present problems, and once you solved them you'll be better off that's for sure- how much no one knows
but I beleive once you fix present problems you'll be good enough

As for receptors- in reality no one knows that much about it, when scientists do research they use some specific equipment and do measurement in voltage (AFAIK)- so most of talk of recpetors is just a guessing game or sometimes even loads of rubbish
just deal with basics and you'll be good enough, leave science to scientists

[ToniBR]

IGFBP3: 4,1 ug/mL 21 to 25 Years Old: 3,4 a 7,8 ug/mL

SOMATOMEDINA C (IGF-I): 430 ng/mL 21 to 25 Years Old: 116 - 358

ANTIBODIES GLIADINA IgA : 1,6 U/mL Non reacting <7,0 U/mL

So, IGF1 high means something else? Could this explain my growing gyno despite in range estradiol? I'm glad to see that, aparently, I have no problems with gluten.

PARATORMÔNIO (PTH): 25,6 (4,0 - 65,0) pg/mL
ACTH: 23,7 (7,2 - 63,3) pg/mL

[Jelisej]

Not quite sure how to interpret your results, typically IGFBP3 and IGF 1 are usually in same range, as IGFBP3 is carrier of IGF,
IGF1 is often either too high or too low in diabetic people, so not sure if your pre-diabetes is affecting igf1 levels,

people with high igf1/hgh to have higher incidences of gyno, but still E2 still does to job, so to speak,
your E2 is on higher level, forget about labs ref ranges, E2 should be around 25, when it gets 10 +/- it start causing problems, tough effects/sides and prefered level depends from person to person.

[ToniBR]

Not quite sure how to interpret your results, typically IGFBP3 and IGF 1 are usually in same range, as IGFBP3 is carrier of IGF,
IGF1 is often either too high or too low in diabetic people, so not sure if your pre-diabetes is affecting igf1 levels,

people with high igf1/hgh to have higher incidences of gyno, but still E2 still does to job, so to speak,
your E2 is on higher level, forget about labs ref ranges, E2 should be around 25, when it gets 10 +/- it start causing problems, tough effects/sides and prefered level depends from person to person.


Could I kill two rabbits going paleo? Maybe low dose AI? I'm all for tips right now. I'm planning to address things using exercise, diet and drugs, if necessary. I'm back to working out full intensity. Squatted today with 150kg, no belt and no help.

[Jelisej]

Could I kill two rabbits going paleo? Maybe low dose AI? I'm all for tips right now. I'm planning to address things using exercise, diet and drugs, if necessary. I'm back to working out full intensity. Squatted today with 150kg, no belt and no help.

Exercise and diet wise even earlier you had a good plan so continue with it, regarding AI and otehr meds- do it only when doctor prescribes, as we agreed earlier, if you self-medicate it will alter your bood tests and it will lead into wrong directions, deal with general health first then move into balancing hormones, at this point you need to be patient, and honestly there is nothing that anyone from this forum can do anything for you at the moment, there is still of of investigations and tests needed as there is possibiity that you have some other underlying problem/condition and untill that is cleared up, it is simply best to either wait or discuss with doc.

[ToniBR]

Exercise and diet wise even earlier you had a good plan so continue with it, regarding AI and otehr meds- do it only when doctor prescribes, as we agreed earlier, if you self-medicate it will alter your bood tests and it will lead into wrong directions, deal with general health first then move into balancing hormones, at this point you need to be patient, and honestly there is nothing that anyone from this forum can do anything for you at the moment, there is still of of investigations and tests needed as there is possibiity that you have some other underlying problem/condition and untill that is cleared up, it is simply best to either wait or discuss with doc.

I know this is a complex problem and I think it's very ethical from you not wanting to propose interventions that might end up making me worse. I won't self medicate, but I think it would hurt to talk about possible approaches. Any dietary change I could do to improve this? I'm really lost because I know that cutting carbs would improve insulin but would also raise cortisol to keep glicemia. Anything SAFE I could do? I don't want to bother you guys too much. I know pfs guys are not very welcome here, so if there is somewhere else (except propecia help) where would be better for me to post please let me know. Anyway, jelisej, you've been helpful. Can you think about any other relevant test I should make? The only thing I can not do is a long fast since there aren't facilities in my country that do that. Cdnuts said himself that these things are dangerous to do by yourself. I'm all good will here, but I need a North.

[Jelisej]

Keep diet as planned- only low GI carbs; cortisol wise- is not much you can do at the moment and there is underlying problem(s) yet to be discovered and solved, until that is done is not much that could be done, any try to help yourself would robably alleviate some of the symptoms, but underlying causes would not be fixed and you would be left in limb,