He Shou Wu decreasing AR Expression / blocking DHT?

[MichaelZurich]

Hey Brothers. Before I toss it to the bin I would like to hear your opinion about this study regarding He Shou Wu actually acting pretty much the opposite as we would like it to act, no?

„ PM extract could prevent androgen induced hair loss by reducing AR expression and preventing hair follicle miniaturization mediated by DHT which are thought to be the main cause of AGA.“

Polygonum multiflorum extract support hair growth by elongating anagen phase and abrogating the effect of androgen in cultured human dermal papilla cells (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218528/)

[Comewhatmay]

You have nothing to worry about there. Do you think CDNuts would include 5ar inhibitors in the herb cycle? Lol. If that was the case there would be no recoveries here and he wouldn't be recovered.

[MichaelZurich]

Hey, I do not doubt CD‘s much appreciated knowledge in any way. The Study is just quite new (2020) and I think CD‘s recovery has been quite some years ago. Maybe the recovery is still possible but a little slower? I have no idea, thats why I am asking the volks for opinion on the study.

Kind Regards


You have nothing to worry about there. Do you think CDNuts would include 5ar inhibitors in the herb cycle? Lol. If that was the case there would be no recoveries here and he wouldn't be recovered.

[MungYarlon]

Hey Brothers. Before I toss it to the bin I would like to hear your opinion about this study regarding He Shou Wu actually acting pretty much the opposite as we would like it to act, no?

„ PM extract could prevent androgen induced hair loss by reducing AR expression and preventing hair follicle miniaturization mediated by DHT which are thought to be the main cause of AGA.“

Polygonum multiflorum extract support hair growth by elongating anagen phase and abrogating the effect of androgen in cultured human dermal papilla cells (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7218528/)

Meh, our AR is overexpressed anyway.

[MichaelZurich]

Meh, our AR is overexpressed anyway.

Ok that makes no sense 😅

[MungYarlon]

Ok that makes no sense 😅

"Overexpression of AR in penile tis-
sue may be responsible for sexual symptoms experienced by PFS
patients.19 If AR is also overexpressed in other tissues, for exam-
ple nervous tissue, it may play a role in cognitive and psychiatric
symptoms as well."

From the Baylor study.
The issue is that there other genes which negatively affect androgen signaling which are overexpressed. I think that's the reason why androgen insensitivity is felt.

[MichaelZurich]

"Overexpression of AR in penile tis-
sue may be responsible for sexual symptoms experienced by PFS
patients.19 If AR is also overexpressed in other tissues, for exam-
ple nervous tissue, it may play a role in cognitive and psychiatric
symptoms as well."

From the Baylor study.
The issue is that there other genes which negatively affect androgen signaling which are overexpressed. I think that's the reason why androgen insensitivity is felt.

Ok wow. That is interesting and once more frightening at the same time 😳 The question remains the same to me tho. If He Shou Wu is downregulating AR (as the cause reason finasteride did) is it harmful or helpful?

[LetsGo]

"Overexpression of AR in penile tis-
sue may be responsible for sexual symptoms experienced by PFS
patients.19 If AR is also overexpressed in other tissues, for exam-
ple nervous tissue, it may play a role in cognitive and psychiatric
symptoms as well."

From the Baylor study.
The issue is that there other genes which negatively affect androgen signaling which are overexpressed. I think that's the reason why androgen insensitivity is felt.

One theory is that the body is trying to overcome androgen insensitivity by increasing the amount of androgen receptors. So PFS guys have lots of receptors, but they’re not working well and overall sexual function is low or nil.

When fully recovered, there should be a normal amount of receptors that work normally or even a bit better than normal, according to CD you can reach pre-industrial levels (meaning the true natural level.)

[MungYarlon]

Ok wow. That is interesting and once more frightening at the same time 😳 The question remains the same to me tho. If He Shou Wu is downregulating AR (as the cause reason finasteride did) is it harmful or helpful?

If it's in the protocol go for it, you're taking it on a cycle anyway, so it shouldn't be too bad. I would tell you not to take it though, because if you are worried you may suffer adversely it can cause you further stress which is no good.

- - - Updated - - -


One theory is that the body is trying to overcome androgen insensitivity by increasing the amount of androgen receptors. So PFS guys have lots of receptors, but they’re not working well and overall sexual function is low or nil.

When fully recovered, there should be a normal amount of receptors that work normally or even a bit better than normal, according to CD you can reach pre-industrial levels (meaning the true natural level.)

Yeah that's what I think. There must be some sort of negative modulator genes linked to the AR which is causing that. Once those are treated, the receptors get agonized, and reduce in number.

[LetsGo]

If it's in the protocol go for it, you're taking it on a cycle anyway, so it shouldn't be too bad. I would tell you not to take it though, because if you are worried you may suffer adversely it can cause you further stress which is no good.

- - - Updated - - -



Yeah that's what I think. There must be some sort of negative modulator genes linked to the AR which is causing that. Once those are treated, the receptors get agonized, and reduce in number.

I wonder if that partly explains the upswings and downswings?

Like your receptors get a little better as you follow the protocol another month or two, so your body reduces the ARs. Now you have a smaller number of somewhat better receptors, but since there’s less of them, it’s not enough for normal sexual function and you have a downswing.

Then you improve the receptors more, have another upswing, and the receptors decrease again. The cycle continues until eventually you have the normal amount of receptors, and your body will not decrease the amount anymore. Then you have a normal amount of high-functioning receptors, and you’re just cured.

[MichaelZurich]

I wonder if that partly explains the upswings and downswings?

Like your receptors get a little better as you follow the protocol another month or two, so your body reduces the ARs. Now you have a smaller number of somewhat better receptors, but since there’s less of them, it’s not enough for normal sexual function and you have a downswing.

Then you improve the receptors more, have another upswing, and the receptors decrease again. The cycle continues until eventually you have the normal amount of receptors, and your body will not decrease the amount anymore. Then you have a normal amount of high-functioning receptors, and you’re just cured.

sounds beautiful mate! I need to hear things like that 🙌🏻 Spreading hope!

[MungYarlon]

I wonder if that partly explains the upswings and downswings?

Like your receptors get a little better as you follow the protocol another month or two, so your body reduces the ARs. Now you have a smaller number of somewhat better receptors, but since there’s less of them, it’s not enough for normal sexual function and you have a downswing.

Then you improve the receptors more, have another upswing, and the receptors decrease again. The cycle continues until eventually you have the normal amount of receptors, and your body will not decrease the amount anymore. Then you have a normal amount of high-functioning receptors, and you’re just cured.

Oh for sure. I definitely think that the upswings and downswings are caused by androgen receptors. Androgen receptors are the only part of the puzzle which can't be solved with supplementation, and yet are THE MOST important part. That's why a protocol is necessary.

Neurotransmitters can be fixed with supplements, as can important growth factor proteins, but the androgen receptor is quite complicated and requires more than just a little trip to the health shop.

[James897]

Ditch the fascist, Chinese sourced herbs, the research on them is usually dodgy and there's plenty of herbs from other countries.

and to that other fellow, lion's mane is a 5ar inhibitor btw, just saying

[Jado]

Oh for sure. I definitely think that the upswings and downswings are caused by androgen receptors. Androgen receptors are the only part of the puzzle which can't be solved with supplementation, and yet are THE MOST important part. That's why a protocol is necessary.

Neurotransmitters can be fixed with supplements, as can important growth factor proteins, but the androgen receptor is quite complicated and requires more than just a little trip to the health shop.

What are the best supplements to fix neurotransmitters? I'm probably already taking them, I'm juat curious what they are.

[MungYarlon]

What are the best supplements to fix neurotransmitters? I'm probably already taking them, I'm juat curious what they are.

https://medium.com/publishous/fixing-your-brain-a-guide-to-balancing-neurotransmitters-72649aab40b1
This is an interesting website that our good friend JoeP26 gave me a while back.

You can try and look at some of them if you are feeling an issue while doing the protocol.

For me, I believe the protocol is useful at fixing the androgen receptors, which can't really be healed any other way.

[Jado]

https://medium.com/publishous/fixing-your-brain-a-guide-to-balancing-neurotransmitters-72649aab40b1
This is an interesting website that our good friend JoeP26 gave me a while back.

You can try and look at some of them if you are feeling an issue while doing the protocol.

For me, I believe the protocol is useful at fixing the androgen receptors, which can't really be healed any other way.

I'll check it out. Thanks