PP raid was fake????

[therealest77]

Some one is claiming that the PP could have possibly been a sham, or possibly didn't happen. No mention of it in the Portland media or anywhere, not even the FDA news.

HeretoStudy; personal thoughts on this???

[weekend]

i have thought about this many times!

totally possible imo.

[therealest77]

I searched high and low on the FDA site, and can't find anything.

I know Eric mentioned some of the companies debt load, but its still hard for me to believe that he would do such a thing

[weekend]

Did the FDA site post anything about CEL or anything?

[Coolazice]

Isn't Eric still buddy-buddy with his ex-girlfriend, Venus, on Facebook (and probably elsewhere)? She's copied all his "Andro" formulas and stole his email lists and the man did nothing about it??? I would have sued, pressed charges, whatever I could do - but he let it all slide. Seems pretty fishy to me.

[weekend]

They were dating!!? Fuckkkkk

[pman42]

i too have briefly entertained this idea but I'm sure their creditors would not just take it on faith; there would be a paper trail with the FDA documents, etc.

it does seem a bit odd that a search only brings up forum results and no FDA or media coverage, like you said, but maybe this isn't the kind of thing the 6 o'clock news can spin, and the FDA is shadowy as fuck.

[Coolazice]

They were dating!!? Fuckkkkk That is my understanding, yes.

[Coolazice]

i too have briefly entertained this idea but I'm sure their creditors would not just take it on faith; there would be a paper trail with the FDA documents, etc.

it does seem a bit odd that a search only brings up forum results and no FDA or media coverage, like you said, but maybe this isn't the kind of thing the 6 o'clock news can spin, and the FDA is shadowy as fuck.

Maybe he did it to file bankruptcy?

Rumors and conspiracy theories.... gotta love them! lol

[testosteronet]

Did the FDA site post anything about CEL or anything?

It was in the news.

[h2s]

I feel like I should not even have to entertain this question, but I will.

I am still in contact with Eric, and never once did I question the raid.

Many people involved in the company lost their job over the raid, myself included. Granted, I was lucky in that it was a "side-cash" gig for me, and not my 9-5, but for many others, this simply wasn't the case. Eric felt he lost everything he had overnight, Matt Porter lost his job, Jared lost his job, etc...These were the public-facing people of the company. Behind that there was payroll, shipping, product design, etc. etc. etc. etc. All of these people had to decide how they would make their living.

I also had spoken to other "big names" in the industry, who had varying opinions on the how and whys of the raid, but never questioned it being legitimate. One big name even provided a lawyer recommendation with industry experience, and I know Eric contacted this individual, both through confirmation by Eric and the person who recommended the lawyer to me/him. I was also spoken to, very directly, about what questions I might face.

I, unfortunately, do not know the process behind the FDA and the release of reports they make. I know others have questioned this as well, such as Right Hook. It is odd. To me it seemed that the entire investigation was very much misguided or somewhat "winged." I say this as Eric had mentioned he was heavily questioned on what illegal ingredients were being added to Andro- products. As many of you know, and others have seen. Eric had submitted to random FDA testing previously, and passed with flying colors. All of the products were extensively tested, and none of them failed. So why question what was added to the products? They also heavily utilized information on the sale of SD-LV to provide a list of complaints to Eric. It seems this was a "take them down, we will figure out why later" type thing, and from the impression I get from Eric, not only is the investigation still in the "open" stage, he doesn't expect actual court proceedings, assuming it comes to that point for quite some time. Maybe this has something to do with the limited amount of information released, but who really knows.

The fact of the matter is, I owe alot to Eric. ALOT. When I did lose my 9-5 job, and spent months looking for work every day, Eric and the generous position he offered to me is what allowed me and my girlfriend to stay afloat. Sure I had a lot of "Side gigs" I balanced, but at the time they would not have been reliable enough to keep food on my table, but Primordial always was. Anytime I needed something from Eric, and I mean ANYTHING, he was always there for me. People used to question my loyalty, not in a negative sense, but why as a "rep" I cared so much, but Eric gave me every reason to, and I was quite happy to. The point of this is that I have no reason to disbelieve Eric, so unless indisputable evidence were to show otherwise, I would refuse to believe ill intent.

[BBG]

I have to agree with John on this. Primordial was Eric's life work. When you think "blood, sweat and tears", that's exactly what Eric but into Primordial on a daily, weekly, monthly, yearly basis. I can imagine Eric making a meager 30 to 40k a year running Primordial Performance and loving every second of it simply because he was so enamored with the supplements he set forth to create.

I have no doubt in time Primordial would have risen from the ashes of a shaky Androseries launch. As reps, John, Rodja, Ryan S, Noa and I really put a lot of time and effort into turning the negative Androseries reception around and making the products known far and wide and some of the greatest and safest PHs to be introduced the market since the original 4/1-ad.

Eric and his crew were and are extremely respectable people and I think it's a shame that the loyal Primordial men and women would think that they would shut down the company simply to avoid paying off loans. The Androseries was JUST starting to really gain a huge crowd. Look at the products now, selling for even more than the full retail price.

I agree with John, unless further evidence is provided that can be backed up with solid proof, I simply have to side with Eric on this one. I knew the man fairly well when I repped for the company and everything I know about him says he was in it for the love of the products he developed. He would have dug out of any hole he was in just to stay in the game.

[DJM]

staring at screen
dont know what to type

[Rulk]

No reason to believe in anything else. I may be biased, but I have a good sense of people when I meet them. I've met many of the crew in person, hung out with them, and to me, they seemed more like a family than a business. Eric would never do this.

[burlyman30]

Spent many many conversations on the phone with Eric over this raid and the resulting fallout. PP had it's troubles, but it was hanging in there and Eric and I were in conversations about the future of PP and his next venture. He was ecstatic about the future, spending quite literally hundreds and hundreds of hours of planning for the next step. He NEEDED PP around for this new vision, as PP was to be funding the new venture. With the end of PP came the end of forward progress for the other project. It crushed him.

Let's shut down the rumor mill, started by people who weren't there, don't know anyone who was there, and are saying things without having any knowledge of the situation.

[Coolazice]

My big questions are:

1. Why are Venus and other companies allowed to make products with identical ingredients and not have anyone go knocking on their door and shutting them down?

2. Why hasn't Eric gone after Venus for her the theft of the "recipes" and the email list? I've been spammed twice now by that crook even though I unsubscribed from "her list" after the first time she spammed me.

[burlyman30]

My big questions are:

1. Why are Venus and other companies allowed to make products with identical ingredients and not have anyone go knocking on their door and shutting them down?

2. Why hasn't Eric gone after Venus for her the theft of the "recipes" and the email list? I've been spammed twice now by that crook even though I unsubscribed from "her list" after the first time she spammed me.

PP wasn't shut down simply because of the Androseries. They had been watching him since he sold 1T Tren and Superdrone, 3 years earlier. So just because someone else is making andro-like products does not mean they will be shut down. One of the most damning pieces of evidence was the label comparisons to a prescription drug (testosterone). Historically, I have seen more supplement companies shut down because of this over anything else. And I'm referring to just health/medical/drug claims of normal nutritional products, not prohormones. Anyway, after 3 years of watching him, they built up a big enough case to do the raid. They still haven't issued a statement saying Androseries products are illegal, nor have they told similar manufactures to cease production. But they aren't making the same drug claims, as far as I know.

Eric hasnt gone after Venus or the guy who started the Alpha products because it just wasn't worth it. I've spoken to him personally over this exact issue, long before the raid happened. There's nothing stopping someone from cloning his products and it's an expensive legal battle when the cash flow just wasn't there. Gaspari never went after all the clones of his halodrol product, either. As far as the email list, I know you're sore about getting spammed by Venus, but it's rarely something that a company would sue over.

[Coolazice]

PP wasn't shut down simply because of the Androseries. They had been watching him since he sold 1T Tren and Superdrone, 3 years earlier. So just because someone else is making andro-like products does not mean they will be shut down. One of the most damning pieces of evidence was the label comparisons to a prescription drug (testosterone). Historically, I have seen more supplement companies shut down because of this over anything else. And I'm referring to just health/medical/drug claims of normal nutritional products, not prohormones. Anyway, after 3 years of watching him, they built up a big enough case to do the raid. They still haven't issued a statement saying Androseries products are illegal, nor have they told similar manufactures to cease production. But they aren't making the same drug claims, as far as I know.

Eric hasnt gone after Venus or the guy who started the Alpha products because it just wasn't worth it. I've spoken to him personally over this exact issue, long before the raid happened. There's nothing stopping someone from cloning his products and it's an expensive legal battle when the cash flow just wasn't there. Gaspari never went after all the clones of his halodrol product, either. As far as the email list, I know you're sore about getting spammed by Venus, but it's rarely something that a company would sue over.

The "drug claims theory" makes sense to me, but it seems odd that they would confiscate (steal) all of his stock and not return it rather than just demand he ceased all sales til product labeling, packaging, advertising, etc was rewritten to their satisfaction.

His stuff wasn't just cloned though. She stole intellectual properties that belonged to the company (Eric) and probably the exact recipes he used to make everything. I understand a company isn't likely to get sued for spamming, but what about theft? Btw, who is the guy she is in cahoots with, since you brought it up?

[burlyman30]

If Eric wanted to shut the doors or couldn't afford to keep them open, he could have just filed bankruptcy and written a sincere apology letter to his customers. There is zero advantage to making up a false FDA story. As far as the confiscation, what better way to put someone out of business than stealing all their inventory without actually having to tell them to shut their doors. They know exactly what they are doing. They took out the "competition" of their "clients" (Big Pharma).

I wasn't inferring that the guy from Forerunner Labs (producing Alpha Bulk, etc) was or is in cahoots with Venus. But I do know that Eric and he were going to collaborate on some products, had unique knowledge of the Andro products and next thing you know, he was using the same base ingredients (in lower doses) and put his own twist on the delivery system. A year later Venus did the same thing, only worse. They were not working together (to my knowledge), nor had they ever. Separate incidents. Sorry for the confusion.

[Coolazice]

If Eric wanted to shut the doors or couldn't afford to keep them open, he could have just filed bankruptcy and written a sincere apology letter to his customers. There is zero advantage to making up a false FDA story. As far as the confiscation, what better way to put someone out of business than stealing all their inventory without actually having to tell them to shut their doors. They know exactly what they are doing. They took out the "competition" of their "clients" (Big Pharma).

I wasn't inferring that the guy from Forerunner Labs (producing Alpha Bulk, etc) was or is in cahoots with Venus. But I do know that Eric and he were going to collaborate on some products, had unique knowledge of the Andro products and next thing you know, he was using the same base ingredients (in lower doses) and put his own twist on the delivery system. A year later Venus did the same thing, only worse. They were not working together (to my knowledge), nor had they ever. Separate incidents. Sorry for the confusion.


You bring up good points (as usual). Big Pharma is the most likely the cause of all this and has been my first choice in logical explanations since the raid happened, but conspiracy theories are fun to play with too.

The misunderstanding was all mine. I wasn't thinking Forerunner Labs at all and was just thinking that the plot was thickening on how Venus got this all off the ground. It doesn't help that "Fred" was the name of the guy who sent the spam out.

[Coolazice]

Spent many many conversations on the phone with Eric over this raid and the resulting fallout. PP had it's troubles, but it was hanging in there and Eric and I were in conversations about the future of PP and his next venture. He was ecstatic about the future, spending quite literally hundreds and hundreds of hours of planning for the next step. He NEEDED PP around for this new vision, as PP was to be funding the new venture. With the end of PP came the end of forward progress for the other project. It crushed him.


Does this new venture happen to be ONEMANWORLD LLC? https://plus.google.com/104607048595058829704/about
That's the business that he registered just 2 weeks (11-13-12) after the big raid. I gotta say - he doesn't look too broken up in that picture he posted. How's that business doing anyway? It sounds like he is just subcontracting himself and his formulas out. Is this correct?

[weekend]

:confused:

[markam]

Does this new venture happen to be ONEMANWORLD LLC? https://plus.google.com/104607048595058829704/about
That's the business that he registered just 2 weeks (11-13-12) after the big raid. I gotta say - he doesn't look too broken up in that picture he posted. How's that business doing anyway? It sounds like he is just subcontracting himself and his formulas out. Is this correct?

Seems to me that Eric wants to be left to his own devices. I'm sure people will hear from him when he feels it's appropriate.

Perhaps it would be best to let him have his quiet time, and I'm not sure threads like this will help. Really would've liked to have tried his latest PCT products, test butter, etc, maybe someday.

[DJM]

did you want him to post a profile picture of him crying?

i dont see girls breaking up with someone, and then adding a profile on match.com using their worst pics either

finally how has this thread made it this far is beyond me

[markam]

Imo, on the basis that the thread title is for want of better words, 'inappropriate', I think this thread should be closed.

Note that I'm not saying it should be deleted, but this sort of conjecture is unnecessary, and not helpful, imo.

[h2s]

My big questions are:

1. Why are Venus and other companies allowed to make products with identical ingredients and not have anyone go knocking on their door and shutting them down?

2. Why hasn't Eric gone after Venus for her the theft of the "recipes" and the email list? I've been spammed twice now by that crook even though I unsubscribed from "her list" after the first time she spammed me.

1. What was Eric going to sue over in terms of the products being similar? Eric did not own the rights to any of the base hormones, in fact he paid royalties on every sale to those that did

2. Eric distances himself as well as he could from her, and wasn't a fan of the email thing any mote than the rest of us were. If you are so upset about the spam, why don't YOU do something about it. Seems to me we have a case similar to those that complain about politics but don't vote. CANSPAM is a real law, and you can easily file a complaint, especially if you really did unsubscribe.


Does this new venture happen to be ONEMANWORLD LLC? https://plus.google.com/104607048595058829704/about
That's the business that he registered just 2 weeks (11-13-12) after the big raid. I gotta say - he doesn't look too broken up in that picture he posted. How's that business doing anyway? It sounds like he is just subcontracting himself and his formulas out. Is this correct?

What are you, Dick Tracy all of the sudden? Eric had plans for a sister company long before the raid. As DJM said, did you expect him to spend the rest of his life crying about spilled milk instead of grabbing a towel and moving on to clean up the mess?

To those that said this should be closed, I very much agree, especially after the direction it spiraled into. Unfortunately, my first commitment to this forum was not to enforce censorship, so no matter how much I disagree with the subject, this community is free to speak their opinions.

[h2s]

Also, I do not claim that Eric is without fault in all of this, and I don't think Eric would argue that either. There are steps that could have been taken much earlier to better protect himself from this, but every thing provides a learning experience.

[Halogenix]

I think hts and company have effectively debunked the conspiracy theory brahs who think that Eric P. staged the FDA raid. Hats off to such a creative suggestion though.

With that being said, official advertising claims made by PP, with the approval of Eric, about testosterone equivalency and 'leading the STEROID revolution' and 'steroids for the mind and body' weren't the most intelligent way to conduct oneself as a gray market business.

One could have easily made the pitch, and they did, that the Andro Series produced results akin to the original 1-AD/4-AD which wasn't too far off given the proper dosage. I suppose hindsight is 20/20 though.

[Rodja]

How does goofy shit like this keep coming up when it comes to PP? First, it was the massive conspiracy with the rep transition, then it was about the delays with the first AM, and now this. Some people really need to get their priorities in life straightened out.

[burlyman30]

Does this new venture happen to be ONEMANWORLD LLC? https://plus.google.com/104607048595058829704/about
That's the business that he registered just 2 weeks (11-13-12) after the big raid. I gotta say - he doesn't look too broken up in that picture he posted. How's that business doing anyway? It sounds like he is just subcontracting himself and his formulas out. Is this correct?

What he had started planning nearly a year prior to the raid and what he is currently doing are two entirely different things.

[Freepressright]

We have a new breed of conspiracy theorists: PP Truthers!

[Jelisej]

Thing is, no one has been cheated by PP, whatever anyone bought from them was delivered- and thats how bussiness is run. We can argue about million things and speculate, but in the end PP was a bussiness like any other shop and shops get open and closed very often, for various reasons... And PP was in reality just an online shop- well organised and their marketing was excellent.

[Freepressright]

Didn't Winslow Jenkins scan and post a business card from an FDA agent and ask any doubters to call this agent and he would tell them more about the raid?

[burlyman30]

Didn't Winslow Jenkins scan and post a business card from an FDA agent and ask any doubters to call this agent and he would tell them more about the raid?

He did indeed.

[DJM]

this thing goes deeper than any of you could fathom

tonight at 9/8c watch as ice goes deeper to uncover eric's true intentions, how venus really is his sister, and the insider is revealed as hector hotstreak, incl a guest appearance by steve buschemi as the president
tonight at 9/8c dont miss it on the CW

[Coolazice]

did you want him to post a profile picture of him crying?

No, definitely not. But for a guy whole "just had his world torn apart" he looks pretty damn happy and confident.


1. What was Eric going to sue over in terms of the products being similar?

Like I said - she stole information from him. Of course she was smart enough to tweak the formulas so they weren't identical, but I'm sure he could have proven she stole the recipes (among other things).


2. If you are so upset about the spam, why don't YOU do something about it. Seems to me we have a case similar to those that complain about politics but don't vote. CANSPAM is a real law, and you can easily file a complaint, especially if you really did unsubscribe.
Never heard of CANSPAM before.... I'll look into it. Thank you!



What are you, Dick Tracy all of the sudden? Eric had plans for a sister company long before the raid. As DJM said, did you expect him to spend the rest of his life crying about spilled milk instead of grabbing a towel and moving on to clean up the mess?

The information was dropped in my lap. I didn't go digging it up. At the same time though, I did find it interesting.


What he had started planning nearly a year prior to the raid and what he is currently doing are two entirely different things.

You didn't answer my questions, Burly. The were actually serious questions.

[Cobalt]

Goddamnit Cool, your avatar made me lose it.

My head hurts I'm laughing so hard.

[Coolazice]

Goddamnit Cool, your avatar made me lose it.

My head hurts I'm laughing so hard.

:D

Glad to see you're not taking all this too seriously. Soon Eric is going to need to see a urologist from them nuts getting hugged a little too tightly. Hope he'll still be able to have kids if he desires to do so.

I like(d) the company and the guy as well as anybody, but that doesn't remove the fact that some things seem fishy and were enough for someone to start this conspiracy thread and in multiple forums too.

[h2s]

:D

Glad to see you're not taking all this too seriously. Soon Eric is going to need to see a urologist from them nuts getting hugged a little too tightly. Hope he'll still be able to have kids if he desires to do so.

I like(d) the company and the guy as well as anybody, but that doesn't remove the fact that some things seem fishy and were enough for someone to start this conspiracy thread and in multiple forums too.

I am not going to waste my time. In fact, I find great pleasure into knowing I don't have nearly the amount of free time that you seem to.

[Coolazice]

I am not going to waste my time. In fact, I find great pleasure into knowing I don't have nearly the amount of free time that you seem to.

LOL... I wish I didn't have this much free time either.

[BoneDaddy]

This is all spiraling into the butt hurt category. Why is everyone so edgy?

[DJM]

:D

Glad to see you're not taking all this too seriously. Soon Eric is going to need to see a urologist from them nuts getting hugged a little too tightly. Hope he'll still be able to have kids if he desires to do so.

I like(d) the company and the guy as well as anybody, but that doesn't remove the fact that some things seem fishy and were enough for someone to start this conspiracy thread and in multiple forums too.

wow, that was pure retardation


LOL... I wish I didn't have this much free time either.
get busy then???

[Coolazice]

This is all spiraling into the butt hurt category. Why is everyone so edgy?
I was wondering the same thing.

[Coolazice]

wow, that was pure retardation

LMAO..... If you say so.



get busy then???

I can't control mother nature and that's the holdup right now.

[Macdon1588]

So, this other company of Eric's ever gonna sell anything directly to the public, or is it a behind the scenes type of venture?

[Freepressright]

I have no questions concerning the validity of the raid. Eric's announcement on the PP page spelled out the terms of the search warrant very clearly and with a lot of supporting detail. If it was bullshit, I'm sure he'd have been visited by authorities and they'd have found a way to take down that page.

I will say that it is strange and unorthodox that there was no news coverage of this raid, given its described magnitude. It's also strange that the FDA deviated from protocol. But we must remember, we're dealing with an authoritarian-style, executive-level government agency. They're governed not necessarily by law, but by regulation, which is a gray area and separate from laws which are created through the process of legislation.

There are many unilateral actions they can take in the course of investigation.

I do not doubt that the raid happened, however I can understand the basis for some to question it. But one should consider the sum total of evidence in support of it actually happening. The FDA investigator's business card and what I mentioned above leaves no doubt in my mind.

[longBallLima]

lol i really dont know what eric had to gain from staging this X just closing shop and saying sorry.
the outcome would have been the same "Sorry, here's your money back"

actually, no. If he close shop he could have said "sorry, here's product from the last batch. ill keep the money to get life back on track"

there's gotta be a reason behind a conspiracy, or else it's just people trying to make ordinary events more interesting for whatever fucking reason lol

[Right Hook]

Just a couple of comments. The relationship with Eric and FRL was largely great. Overtime he ran into some obstacles, and those people who helped out originally did so again. Nobody wanted him to get raided by the FDA. It's bad business for everyone.

I heard a rumor a few times at the Arnold that suggested the close of business was unrelated to the FDA. But it's unsubstantiated, and in the end doesn't really matter.

I wouldn't worry, he will be back, and smarter next time.

O and I can't fucking stand the AF crew. Sleezy shit. I was trolling "Fred" over email the other day. Nobody from FRL or AMS had anything to do with AF.

[longBallLima]

Just a couple of comments. The relationship with Eric and FRL was largely great. Overtime he ran into some obstacles, and those people who helped out originally did so again. Nobody wanted him to get raided by the FDA. It's bad business for everyone.

I heard a rumor a few times at the Arnold that suggested the close of business was unrelated to the FDA. But it's unsubstantiated, and in the end doesn't really matter.

I wouldn't worry, he will be back, and smarter next time.

O and I can't fucking stand the AF crew. Sleezy shit. I was trolling "Fred" over email the other day. Nobody from FRL or AMS had anything to do with AF.

i trolled venus when that shit first came out. that chick's mug annoys the shit out of me. i think she's still my FB buddy. she doesnt mind the insults it seems

[Macdon1588]

Has anyone here ever really dealt with a government agency? Throughout my military and personal career I have had exposure to different government agencies and I can tell you first hand that this is how they do business. The reason why you can't find anything about the FDA raid is because there's no accountability. If you speak out about the actions that they do, you should know they have the capacity to make your life endlessly more difficult than you could ever imagine. Most of the agencies are government sanctioned mafias where it is just easier to play their game than it is to fight them.

[therealest77]

I feel like I should not even have to entertain this question, but I will.

I am still in contact with Eric, and never once did I question the raid.

Many people involved in the company lost their job over the raid, myself included. Granted, I was lucky in that it was a "side-cash" gig for me, and not my 9-5, but for many others, this simply wasn't the case. Eric felt he lost everything he had overnight, Matt Porter lost his job, Jared lost his job, etc...These were the public-facing people of the company. Behind that there was payroll, shipping, product design, etc. etc. etc. etc. All of these people had to decide how they would make their living.

I also had spoken to other "big names" in the industry, who had varying opinions on the how and whys of the raid, but never questioned it being legitimate. One big name even provided a lawyer recommendation with industry experience, and I know Eric contacted this individual, both through confirmation by Eric and the person who recommended the lawyer to me/him. I was also spoken to, very directly, about what questions I might face.

I, unfortunately, do not know the process behind the FDA and the release of reports they make. I know others have questioned this as well, such as Right Hook. It is odd. To me it seemed that the entire investigation was very much misguided or somewhat "winged." I say this as Eric had mentioned he was heavily questioned on what illegal ingredients were being added to Andro- products. As many of you know, and others have seen. Eric had submitted to random FDA testing previously, and passed with flying colors. All of the products were extensively tested, and none of them failed. So why question what was added to the products? They also heavily utilized information on the sale of SD-LV to provide a list of complaints to Eric. It seems this was a "take them down, we will figure out why later" type thing, and from the impression I get from Eric, not only is the investigation still in the "open" stage, he doesn't expect actual court proceedings, assuming it comes to that point for quite some time. Maybe this has something to do with the limited amount of information released, but who really knows.

The fact of the matter is, I owe alot to Eric. ALOT. When I did lose my 9-5 job, and spent months looking for work every day, Eric and the generous position he offered to me is what allowed me and my girlfriend to stay afloat. Sure I had a lot of "Side gigs" I balanced, but at the time they would not have been reliable enough to keep food on my table, but Primordial always was. Anytime I needed something from Eric, and I mean ANYTHING, he was always there for me. People used to question my loyalty, not in a negative sense, but why as a "rep" I cared so much, but Eric gave me every reason to, and I was quite happy to. The point of this is that I have no reason to disbelieve Eric, so unless indisputable evidence were to show otherwise, I would refuse to believe ill intent.

I'm with ya HereTo..

As I stated in my post (#3), I find it hard believe as well.

My intentions were to get thoughts on the accusation, not to accuse. I've been a supporter of Eric since day one

[sandman]

Does it really matter if they were raided or not? Either way the products are gone. Why they are gone isn't all that important, the fact they are gone is what is important. Take away the Androseries and a lot of people loved their non-hormonal products. It was going to be a lose lose situation for Primordial Performance anyway, they did all the research and spent all the money in development. It was only a matter of time before other companies started cloning the products. Look at Competitive Edge Labs, they made their whole company around clones.

[therealest77]

Spent many many conversations on the phone with Eric over this raid and the resulting fallout. PP had it's troubles, but it was hanging in there and Eric and I were in conversations about the future of PP and his next venture. He was ecstatic about the future, spending quite literally hundreds and hundreds of hours of planning for the next step. He NEEDED PP around for this new vision, as PP was to be funding the new venture. With the end of PP came the end of forward progress for the other project. It crushed him.

Let's shut down the rumor mill, started by people who weren't there, don't know anyone who was there, and are saying things without having any knowledge of the situation.

Hope you don't think I started the rumor mill burley. It was actually a guy over at AM for the record.

I may not have met any of the PP team face to face. But I've had long conversations and history with those guys. As I mentioned before, I've been a PP customer and Supporter since day 1. And my intentions for starting this thread was to obtain thoughts on the accusations.

HereTo please delete this thread

[BBG]

Heh I loved those Daffy Duck Dick Tracy cartoons...

[h2s]

Hope you don't think I started the rumor mill burley. It was actually a guy over at AM for the record.

I may not have met any of the PP team face to face. But I've had long conversations and history with those guys. As I mentioned before, I've been a PP customer and Supporter since day 1. And my intentions for starting this thread was to obtain thoughts on the accusations.

HereTo please delete this thread

There is no reason to delete it, the air has been cleared, and no one was really accusing you. It didn't seem you had ill intent. I would like a link to that AM thread though. It has been awhile since I owned recent BB.com converts.

[Rodja]

One of your BFFs is leading the charge, too:
Primordial Performance + FDA Raid! - Page 3 (http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/221676-primordial-performance-fda-3.html)

[Bucks]

Hope you don't think I started the rumor mill burley. It was actually a guy over at AM for the record.

I may not have met any of the PP team face to face. But I've had long conversations and history with those guys. As I mentioned before, I've been a PP customer and Supporter since day 1. And my intentions for starting this thread was to obtain thoughts on the accusations.

HereTo please delete this thread


I saw the thread on AM as well.

I've had arguments with sellers that rep AF that state Eric is behind building the AF brand. I believe that's where this shit is coming from on the boards.
This is just a shady way to try and makes sales of their products just like on AM they always use the Androseries names to describe the new AF products.

I loved the PP products and it pisses me off that someone would create all this bullshit to try and make a sale off another's sweaty ass so I refuse to give any money to that company !

[burlyman30]

Hope you don't think I started the rumor mill burley. It was actually a guy over at AM for the record.

Naw, I didn't think it was you. All is good. :)

[Bucks]

I would like a link to that AM thread though. It has been awhile since I owned recent BB.com converts.

Said link below

Shared post from 'AnabolicMinds.com' by RogerBob from thread 'Primordial Performance + FDA Raid!':

Primordial performance busted then? sounds heavy

Primordial Performance (http://www.primordialperformance.com/)

Shared via Am.com.

[Bucks]

Sorry tried using my phone and the hyperlink didn't copy over.

[h2s]

I posted over there. Now I am running late for the gym and wasted too much time. I will be back later. Jbry is a bitch on a rag that drives me nuts.

[DJM]

jbry is the man!!!!
gives out tons of advice, has used every ph there is, twice, but is skinny fat 170lb.......and when i called him out on AM once he brought up some bs about food and genetics.....hard to take advice from someone who doesnt follow it themselves, and in this millieu, doesnt look the part

again anyone with any fkn common sense between their ears would laugh at any thought of some sort of under handed conspiracy, but there is obviously many who lack such a simple thing

[O_RYAN_007]

jbry is the man!!!!
gives out tons of advice, has used every ph there is, twice, but is skinny fat 170lb.......and when i called him out on AM once he brought up some bs about food and genetics.....hard to take advice from someone who doesnt follow it themselves, and in this millieu, doesnt look the part

again anyone with any fkn common sense between their ears would laugh at any thought of some sort of under handed conspiracy, but there is obviously many who lack such a simple thing

This is correct!

[Coolazice]

again anyone with any fkn common sense between their ears would laugh at any thought of some sort of under handed conspiracy, but there is obviously many who lack such a simple thing

*Or they are just having fun with this thread. ;)

[DJM]

*Or they are just having fun with this thread. ;)

on multiple boards? that post on AM looks of someone seeking an audience, no?

[Coolazice]

on multiple boards? that post on AM looks of someone seeking an audience, no?

Yes on multiple boards. Like I said on AM, I thought it was pretty interesting and worth sharing.

You don't seem to mind coming after me on multiple boards so what is the difference in me posting the same thing on 2 boards?

[ctAL]

damn..........guess ill have to read through this thread in the morning.

[h2s]

You know who is a dumb cunt? Venus.

[h2s]

Androfactory's products vs. primordial performaces - Page 5 (http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/222814-androfactorys-products-vs-5.html)

[Sperwer]

I have it on good authority that Jimmy Hoffa is buried in the foundation of Eric's Mom's house and that Eric was the second shooter on the grassy knoll.

579

[nate3993]

Why was it asked that you not name your forum?

[Jiigzz]

Why was it asked that you not name your forum?

On AM? HTS runs this forum and david dunn wouldn't appreciate HTS openly advertising it on AM. It is a business after all.

[h2s]

On AM? HTS runs this forum and david dunn wouldn't appreciate HTS openly advertising it on AM. It is a business after all.

This. Although when I was called out on it, it wasn't used in a recruitment way, but whatever.

[Fat Bill Dwyer]

I have it on good authority that Jimmy Hoffa is buried in the foundation of Eric's Mom's house and that Eric was the second shooter on the grassy knoll.

579

It all makes sense now!

[BBG]

Why was it asked that you not name your forum?


On AM? HTS runs this forum and david dunn wouldn't appreciate HTS openly advertising it on AM. It is a business after all.


This. Although when I was called out on it, it wasn't don't in a recruitment way, but whatever.

Meanwhile I had swolesource.com in my signature... and I think I still do.

[sandman]

Clicked on the link to go over to BB.com jr, no offense but you guys are looking like a jealous ex girlfriend over there. JBry is destroying you guys everytime you ignore his requests.

[Coolazice]

Clicked on the link to go over to BB.com jr, no offense but you guys are looking like a jealous ex girlfriend over there. JBry is destroying you guys everytime you ignore his requests.

Link?

[sandman]

Primordial Performance + FDA Raid! - Page 4 (http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/221676-primordial-performance-fda-4.html)

[Coolazice]

Primordial Performance + FDA Raid! - Page 4 (http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplements/221676-primordial-performance-fda-4.html)

That's not BB.com...it's AM.

[h2s]

Clicked on the link to go over to BB.com jr, no offense but you guys are looking like a jealous ex girlfriend over there. JBry is destroying you guys everytime you ignore his requests.

I hardly feel destroyed. I told him there is nothing to link him to. Jbry just likes to create controversy and then place himself in the middle of it for the attention. It is like his transfer from swinging on nate's dick while with Need2, to talking shit about them (and creating a website trying to "out" them).

Based on the outpour of reception I have been getting there..between rep posts and guys sending me PMs asking how I been and why I still bother with these ass clowns, I don't think my posts are being interpreted that way.

[h2s]

That's not BB.com...it's AM.

BB.com jr = AM.com

[Coolazice]

BB.com jr = AM.com

Oh. lol I thought the jr was an insult directed at you by calling you junior or something. Thanks for the 411... us older guys can't keep up with all the new acronyms and nicknames.

[nate3993]

Sandman. You don't seem to be very supportive here at all. Why do you even come here? All I see is negativity from you.

[sandman]

Sandman. You don't seem to be very supportive here at all. Why do you even come here? All I see is negativity from you.

Negativity? Or honesty? I have no interest in the arguement and could care less. I think it's nonsense for anyone to question it in the first place but it's also nonsense to respond without proof It's just not a good look. This place has a lot of blind PP support and just because I don't just jump in and support something to a point where they could do no wrong doesn't mean I'm being negative. I'm just giving an honest outlook from the normal point of view even if that's not the point of view from a lot of people around here.

[longBallLima]

eric is in some tropical paradise showering himself in andro and spending the money he returned (?!?) to the customers. he's such a crafty conspirator that he manages to spend money he returned.

all the while, him and george clooney act, through one Venus Winkler, known asshole and overall pity of a human being, selling diluted versions of his own creations. you know, for kicks.

it goes all the way to the top. don't ask too much or Obama will have you drone-attacked or bin laden'd

[DJM]

eric is in some tropical paradise showering himself in andro and spending the money he returned (?!?) to the customers. he's such a crafty conspirator that he manages to spend money he returned.

all the while, him and george clooney act, through one Venus Winkler, known asshole and overall pity of a human being, selling diluted versions of his own creations. you know, for kicks.

it goes all the way to the top. don't ask too much or Obama will have you drone-attacked or bin laden'd

$20 says bin laden is on that same island

[longBallLima]

Negativity? Or honesty? I have no interest in the arguement and could care less. I think it's nonsense for anyone to question it in the first place but it's also nonsense to respond without proof It's just not a good look. This place has a lot of blind PP support and just because I don't just jump in and support something to a point where they could do no wrong doesn't mean I'm being negative. I'm just giving an honest outlook from the normal point of view even if that's not the point of view from a lot of people around here.

lol the burden of proof doesn't lie with the ones making stupid, senseless accusations with NO PROOF other than it hasn't hit the news?

Cuz it's such a hot story right, a business that probably didn't move a couple of mil a year being shut down.

In other news, some city worker put a notice on my door saying that i better get tags for my old truck or put it in the fucking garage. if CNN doesn't cover it, im lying.

you guys really stretch it to have something to talk about.

PS - saying you're not negative doesn't make it true. you stretch logic to where it accommodates the "opposite" side and make no allowances to HTS' point of view, regardless of the fact that many, both here and there, thought he actually presented good points. We all know he is personally invested. He's disclaimed his personal relationship with Eric. Your boy there admitted not even reading his points yet you say he made HTS sound like a bitter ex girlfriend. Give me a break. at this point, you are starting to sound like a plain hater.

- - - Updated - - -


$20 says bin laden is on that same island

and is HYOOOOGE since eric dropped his stock of andro in the water of said island. it is his ultimate experiment in androgenics. an island of mutant giants.

[DJM]

sorry to say, in the scope of things, just the supp industry, pp was tiny, very tiny, thus i could see them not being newsworthy

[longBallLima]

sorry to say, in the scope of things, just the supp industry, pp was tiny, very tiny, thus i could see them not being newsworthy

no fucking way, such news would have Anderson Cooper flying his handsome ass to Oregon to cover that scandal!!!

[longBallLima]

Sandman, going further, like I said, HTS disclaimed his personal investment in this situation. What is yours? Seems like you have an agenda in contributing with your point of view whenever there is a gap to bash PP, its product line or its former owner, but no such interest in the opposite. I thought Cool was pushing it when he thought you were stirring to hype another company, but i'm starting to think he may be on to something and there may be some less than explicit interest here.

[nate3993]

plus sand, it's not even about being loyal to primordial. you weren't all that hot about the company, that's fine, but you're not positive to ANY members here about anything really. but, hate as you like. pretty sure dave Chapelle created a place for you ;)

[BoneDaddy]

plus sand, it's not even about being loyal to primordial. you weren't all that hot about the company, that's fine, but you're not positive to ANY members here about anything really. but, hate as you like. pretty sure dave Chapelle created a place for you ;)

580

[sandman]

lol the burden of proof doesn't lie with the ones making stupid, senseless accusations with NO PROOF other than it hasn't hit the news?

Cuz it's such a hot story right, a business that probably didn't move a couple of mil a year being shut down.

In other news, some city worker put a notice on my door saying that i better get tags for my old truck or put it in the fucking garage. if CNN doesn't cover it, im lying.

you guys really stretch it to have something to talk about.

PS - saying you're not negative doesn't make it true. you stretch logic to where it accommodates the "opposite" side and make no allowances to HTS' point of view, regardless of the fact that many, both here and there, thought he actually presented good points. We all know he is personally invested. He's disclaimed his personal relationship with Eric. Your boy there admitted not even reading his points yet you say he made HTS sound like a bitter ex girlfriend. Give me a break. at this point, you are starting to sound like a plain hater.

- - - Updated - - -



and is HYOOOOGE since eric dropped his stock of andro in the water of said island. it is his ultimate experiment in androgenics. an island of mutant giants.

That's one of the dumbest posts ever. I wasn't supporting either side as I feel both sides are wrong here. Also if someone put a notice on your car. That letter would be your proof. If you threw it away then that's just your own stupidity.

[islandmagic]

need to build muscle---- FDA please look into them please

[longBallLima]

That's one of the dumbest posts ever. I wasn't supporting either side as I feel both sides are wrong here. Also if someone put a notice on your car. That letter would be your proof. If you threw it away then that's just your own stupidity.
yeah, everything sounds stupid when a dumb brick is trying to understand it. did i say no proof exists or did i say that the conspiracy theorists and their nuthuggers (such as yourself) are claiming that the proof of burden lies on HTS due to the fact that there was no media coverage and nothing on the FDA website?

My notice didn't get media coverage. It's not listed on the city website. So I guess if anyone questions it, to "pwnt" them and not sound like a jealous ex gf, i have to scan it and put it online

So, according to you, Eric should put the notices, warnings and whatever else he got on the internet, with all the information on what is, according to him, a pending case on the internet so you can get jbry's cock and balls out of your mouth?

[Cobalt]

Just want to add my opinion before this gets locked...

581582583584

Sorry if it hurt anyone's feelings. ;)

[h2s]

Guys, just don't. Not on this board.

[longBallLima]

done on my part, i'll play nice.

[sandman]

I'm sorry H2S, I'll let the slow children go. We should chip in and let him learn to read, maybe for Christmas?

[burlyman30]

Enough. This thread has run its course and spiraled to insult-swapping.

- - - Updated - - -

Closed.

[DJM]

Enough.

this
this thread will be closed, not because of censorship but the dumbing down of the site

both sides were aired, at this point who fkn cares, it changes nothing,,, worry bout your next meal instead