Stoppani's Pre-Jym is the best preworkout I've ever tried

Stacked with noxygen it is INSANE. The pumps are unbelievable. I wasn't even chasing a pump, but my tri's and delts inflated like no other.

1 scoop pre jym, 2 noxygen. Taste was great as well, like a cherry pie with ice cream. Odd description, but the best I could come up with.

I'd scratch the BA, add an extra 1g of Betaine to get the clinical dose, switch out CM for L-citrulline, and probably take out the NAC as well.

I thought CM was superior to plain L-citrulline. I've taken the plain L form before in high doses and didn't feel as though it did squat. But the malate form at 6-8 grams gave me head pressure.

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Originally Posted by Freepressright

I thought CM was superior to plain L-citrulline. I've taken the plain L form before in high doses and didn't feel as though it did squat. But the malate form at 6-8 grams gave me head pressure.

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CM is L-citrulline bound to a malate at either a 1:1 or 2:1. It was originally thought that CM was superior, but it has now shifted to straight L-citrulline.

I'm not arguing with you, but where is the shift occurring and which companies are switching back to the plain L-form?

Stoppani explains here why he suggests at least 6g of CM:

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In the gym, my other lab, I’ve found that when working with doses found in most supplements, anywhere from 1-3 grams, L-citrulline provides more of a potent pump than citrulline malate. Citrulline malate, on the other hand, provides more of a strength and endurance boost during workouts than L-citrulline does. However, if you increase the dose of citrulline malate (with a ctrulline malate product that delivers citrulline at a 2:1 ratio of malate) to about 6 grams or more, it delivers significant improvements in muscle strength and endurance while increasing the muscle pump like you wouldn't believe. Let’s take a closer look at the research that further supports what I’ve seen in the gym.

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Citrulline vs. Arginine

Aaaaand it's sold out everywhere now that I'm ready to order.

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Originally Posted by BoneDaddy

Aaaaand it's sold out everywhere now that I'm ready to order.

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I know! I had to order All-In because I can't find any Pre-Jym.

I can understand why. This stuff's the cat's ass. I haven't seen a single person claim this stuff didn't deliver.

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Originally Posted by Freepressright

I'm not arguing with you, but where is the shift occurring and which companies are switching back to the plain L-form?

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Athletix/PES for starters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Freepressright

Stoppani explains here why he suggests at least 6g of CM:



Citrulline vs. Arginine

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His point regarding additional malic acid for the Krebs cycle for PCr production is pretty much moot because of the inclusion of CrHCl. That being said, I've never been a fan of any "pump" product from an ergogenic perspective. They're almost purely cosmetic with little to no sarcoplasmic or myofibrillar hypertrophy.