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  1. #381
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0 GoldenSun's Avatar
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    How long have you technically been on the protocol? Like after a fast doing Herbs/Cardio/Lifting etc? Just wondering.

    And trust me I have been in bad spots recently, I have feel off for a while too but I'm continuing my positive outlook because of the improvements I have experienced (even if they fade away and come back later).

    I have a gf so I do have sex, get head, jerk off even. I know sex doesn't count as fapping but I still do fap and I want to quit (even though I don't watch porn). Not trying to be judgmental but skimming through your thread you seem to have a hyper focus on getting morning wood and doing no fap.
    Obviously quitting jerking it is good for recovery but also (someone can correct me if I am wrong) I don't think its anywhere as necessary as working out/ getting sun/ eating well.

    For me I had a similar fixation with Body odor. Basically my body odor disappeared after I crashed, and when I did my first juice fast it came back for a week, over this summer it came back in FULL FORCE for about 3 months. It has tapered since then and it got me depressed for a while. But I realized that my body odor going back to being weak doesn't mean I am fucked and I know it will come back again.

    My advice is to stop obsessing with Morning wood and No fap, just try your best not to fap but if you make it 30 days no fap and don't feel cured, don't be depressed. No fap in itself was never the protocol.

    Now if you have been doing working out, dieting, sun exposer, herbs, no drugs/drinking for a year and feel like shit and never have upswings I would be worried. But that doesn't seem to be the case
    Last edited by GoldenSun; 09-24-2022 at 01:06 PM.

  2. #382
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    You're depressed about not making progress, but you didn't do anything this year... I don't get it man. And even the other years, what's the longest stretch you did with everything perfect? Reading your posts, it doesn't seem like it was a lot. And why didn't you follow up your fast with the protocol?

    Prohormones can feel like nothing, or even bad. You're still upregulating 5ar and downregulating androgen receptors behind the curtains. Look up Ricktheruler's first cycle, he felt worse on it.

    And let's say you were 100% dedicated and not seeing results, then I would tell you to rule out other co-conditions that might be hindering progress. Lyme, EBV, gut issues (see my post above), hashimoto, STD. Even with 100% TMO, those issues will drag you down, and make progress harder. As an example, ever since I started treating my gut I have seen major improvements in muscle size, exercise tolerance, weight, sleep, and sexual. I was stalling before that.

    My bad but it pisses me off to see someone that doesn't do much come here and say they're depressed about making no progress. I was worse than you and I made big progress by working my ass off. You need huge stretches of perfection, not spurts.

    This place is more quiet recently, and I'm trying to be more present so that we can motivate each other among those remaining. But saying you're immune to recovering while not having done shit for the whole year is some PropeciaHelp type shit

    I'm rooting for your recovery

  3. #383
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outlaw View Post
    You're depressed about not making progress, but you didn't do anything this year... I don't get it man. And even the other years, what's the longest stretch you did with everything perfect? Reading your posts, it doesn't seem like it was a lot. And why didn't you follow up your fast with the protocol?

    Prohormones can feel like nothing, or even bad. You're still upregulating 5ar and downregulating androgen receptors behind the curtains. Look up Ricktheruler's first cycle, he felt worse on it.

    And let's say you were 100% dedicated and not seeing results, then I would tell you to rule out other co-conditions that might be hindering progress. Lyme, EBV, gut issues (see my post above), hashimoto, STD. Even with 100% TMO, those issues will drag you down, and make progress harder. As an example, ever since I started treating my gut I have seen major improvements in muscle size, exercise tolerance, weight, sleep, and sexual. I was stalling before that.

    My bad but it pisses me off to see someone that doesn't do much come here and say they're depressed about making no progress. I was worse than you and I made big progress by working my ass off. You need huge stretches of perfection, not spurts.

    This place is more quiet recently, and I'm trying to be more present so that we can motivate each other among those remaining. But saying you're immune to recovering while not having done shit for the whole year is some PropeciaHelp type shit

    I'm rooting for your recovery
    I tried an alternate protocol through most of this year, which didn’t work. When I did the water fast, I was trying to reboot my testosterone with that, which also didn’t work. I’d also heard that it can produce some benefits that stick around, but I didn’t notice any.

    I got mono (Epstein-Barr virus) in late 2019 and was sick for around 4 to 6 weeks and felt very fatigued, during which time I stopped working out. The fatigue went away. Do I need to get some type of test to see if I still have mono? I think if I still had it, I’d be experiencing chronic fatigue which thankfully I have not. But I’ve also never gotten back to where I was before I got mono. I was experiencing pretty noticeable benefits from the protocol in relatively short timeframes, and in 2021 I didn’t, despite better compliance with the protocol.

    I did not say that I was immune to recovering, it’s just a fear that I have. Like fears that I used up my chance to get better in 2019, and now my body somehow won’t respond to the protocol as strongly as it did back then. Why else would it be that I felt more progress in 2019, and since then it hasn’t had the same effects?

    I am not totally sure if I’m depressed or not. I don’t feel actively sad, but I don’t get enjoyment from anything at all. If I could feel like I’m progressing towards recovery from PFS I’m sure that that would help my mood. OTOH if I have no hope of ever recovering then I’d need to plan accordingly. I barely remember what it’s like to not have PFS.

    During this time when I was “doing nothing” in terms of the protocol I built a six figure business, and I’m not a loser.

    Comparing me to other people doesn’t help me. My personality type doesn’t respond positively to negative reinforcement.

    Despite what you say, I have had significant stretches of taking the herbs, doing the workouts, following the diet, no alcohol, no medications, using natural soaps, and I feel like I should have felt progress building up from that over time. The stretches were not long enough evidently, and I get that progress needs to be measured in years, but I have seen others experience noticeable signs of progress after 3, 6 months that lets them know “yeah, I am building up towards recovery and if I keep doing this, I’ll be cured.” I haven’t had that since 2019. I have mostly failed with NoFap, my sleep is inconsistent, and I don’t have a good window for sunning myself.

    Acting frustrated towards me / putting me down is not going to help me with my recovery. It’s really not going to help me.
    Last edited by LetsGo; 09-24-2022 at 01:58 PM.

  4. #384
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    I tried an alternate protocol through most of this year, which didn’t work. When I did the water fast, I was trying to reboot my testosterone with that, which also didn’t work. I’d also heard that it can produce some benefits that stick around, but I didn’t notice any.

    I got mono (Epstein-Barr virus) in late 2019 and was sick for around 4 to 6 weeks and felt very fatigued, during which time I stopped working out. The fatigue went away. Do I need to get some type of test? I have never gotten back to where I was before I got mono. Before I got mono my testosterone was probably back to normal since I had been having strong morning wood for awhile.

    I did not say that I was immune to recovering, it’s just a fear that I have. Like I used up my chance to get better in 2019, and now my body won’t respond to the protocol as strongly as it did back then. I was noticing significant progress back then and in subsequent years, doing the protocol more strictly, I did not feel progress. Is it bad to talk about fears / seek reassurance?

    I have had long stretches of taking the herbs, doing the workouts, following the diet, no alcohol, no medications, using natural soaps, and I feel like I should have felt progress building up from that over time. While there are ups and downs, over a few months you should be able to look back and see definite improvements, which was only really true for me in 2019. I have mostly failed with NoFap, my sleep is inconsistent, and I don’t have a good window for sunning myself.

    Acting frustrated towards me / putting me down is not going to help me with my recovery. It’s really not going to help me.
    You could get an EBV test. A positive IGM marker means you have an active infection, and a positive IGG marker means you have had an active infection in the past.

    I gave you some pointers in my reply a few days ago, but you didn't acknowledge them. Rule out stuff. I would do the following tests: Lyme, EBV, SIBO, and a complete stool test (GI-MAP).

    Im not putting you down man. Goldensun basically said the exact same thing as me in his reply, I was just being more direct. And if more people were active here, they would say the same thing. And geez, when I say you did nothing this year of course I'm only talking protocol-wise.

    And you edited your last post, but you initially said you had numerous 6+ months stretches of perfect protocol. Looking at your thread, I don't see it, when was that? You said it yourself, you can't compare yourself to people timeline-wise. I made good progress for the first 6 months, and then I went through hell for a complete year. In your thread, you see a 7day no fap as a success, so surely you're not completely fucked. For the first 18 months I must've fapped 10 times, because it would crash me badly.

    I'm not attacking you, I'm questioning how dedicated you are. Absolutely, you can come here to seek reassurance if you're doing the work this forum is built around. But seeking reassurance while doing absolutely nothing? What's the point man? I'm super willing to help you man, I have learned a shitload about co-infections and gut issues, and it has really helped my recovery. But if you're gonna complain that you think you're immune to recovering while doing absolutely nothing, then maybe Propeciahelp is more fitting for you.
    Last edited by Outlaw; 09-24-2022 at 03:06 PM.

  5. #385
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenSun View Post
    How long have you technically been on the protocol? Like after a fast doing Herbs/Cardio/Lifting etc? Just wondering.

    And trust me I have been in bad spots recently, I have feel off for a while too but I'm continuing my positive outlook because of the improvements I have experienced (even if they fade away and come back later).

    I have a gf so I do have sex, get head, jerk off even. I know sex doesn't count as fapping but I still do fap and I want to quit (even though I don't watch porn). Not trying to be judgmental but skimming through your thread you seem to have a hyper focus on getting morning wood and doing no fap.
    Obviously quitting jerking it is good for recovery but also (someone can correct me if I am wrong) I don't think its anywhere as necessary as working out/ getting sun/ eating well.

    For me I had a similar fixation with Body odor. Basically my body odor disappeared after I crashed, and when I did my first juice fast it came back for a week, over this summer it came back in FULL FORCE for about 3 months. It has tapered since then and it got me depressed for a while. But I realized that my body odor going back to being weak doesn't mean I am fucked and I know it will come back again.

    My advice is to stop obsessing with Morning wood and No fap, just try your best not to fap but if you make it 30 days no fap and don't feel cured, don't be depressed. No fap in itself was never the protocol.

    Now if you have been doing working out, dieting, sun exposer, herbs, no drugs/drinking for a year and feel like shit and never have upswings I would be worried. But that doesn't seem to be the case
    I am not sure how long it is if you add it all up. I have paper calendars tracking every day that I worked out, and this year it stopped in February which I know is inexcusable etc, but I don’t want to lie because what’s the point of that?

    I am very focused on getting morning wood because that’s one of the body’s biggest signs for low testosterone. I feel bad that it’s in the mid-300s and every day when I wake up without morning wood, I know that that’s the case. It just feels bad. Also my pubic and lower back hair has been thin, but I’m not really worried about the asthetics of it. I can still get body odor but not as much as pre-fin.

    It’s rough for me and hard to go 100% back into the workouts, etc when the last time I did it, I didn’t feel benefits accumulating. (But maybe it was because I didn’t have NoFap under control.) I feel like I must have been doing something wrong last time. I don’t know if I need to do yet another fast immediately before, or if the 21 day fast is still “good”, etc.

  6. #386
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0 GoldenSun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    I am not sure how long it is if you add it all up. I have paper calendars tracking every day that I worked out, and this year it stopped in February which I know is inexcusable etc, but I don’t want to lie because what’s the point of that?

    I am very focused on getting morning wood because that’s one of the body’s biggest signs for low testosterone. I feel bad that it’s in the mid-300s and every day when I wake up without morning wood, I know that that’s the case. It just feels bad. Also my pubic and lower back hair has been thin, but I’m not really worried about the asthetics of it. I can still get body odor but not as much as pre-fin.

    It’s rough for me and hard to go 100% back into the workouts, etc when the last time I did it, I didn’t feel benefits accumulating. (But maybe it was because I didn’t have NoFap under control.) I feel like I must have been doing something wrong last time. I don’t know if I need to do yet another fast immediately before, or if the 21 day fast is still “good”, etc.
    Dude. You did the 21 day fast, that is great. Now get on the protocol! Don't re fast 21 days and than do trib cycles, no work outs etc. Please just get on the protocol. And once again, I really don't think no fap is your make or break thing when you are not even in the gym.

  7. #387
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outlaw View Post
    You could get an EBV test. A positive IGM marker means you have an active infection, and a positive IGG marker means you have had an active infection in the past.

    I gave you some pointers in my reply a few days ago, but you didn't acknowledge them. Rule out stuff. I would do the following tests: Lyme, EBV, SIBO, and a complete stool test (GI-MAP).

    Im not putting you down man. Goldensun basically said the exact same thing as me in his reply, I was just being more direct. And if more people were active here, they would say the same thing. I don't care about your personality type, I'm not gonna sugar coat this. And when I say you did nothing this year, of course I'm talking protocol-wise. Geez.

    And you edited your last post, but you initially said you had numerous 6+ months stretches of perfect protocol. Looking at your thread, I don't see it, when was that? You said it yourself, you can't compare yourself to people timeline-wise. I made good progress for the first 6 months, and then I went through hell for a complete year. In your thread, you see a 7day no fap as a success, so surely you're not completely fucked. For the first 18 months I must've fapped 10 times, because it would crash me badly.

    I'm not attacking you, I'm questioning how dedicated you are. Absolutely, you can come here to seek reassurance if you're doing the work this forum is built around. But seeking reassurance while doing absolutely nothing? What's the point man? I'm super willing to help you man, I have learned a shitload about co-infections and gut issues, and it has really helped my recovery. But if you're gonna complain that you think you're immune to recovering while doing absolutely nothing, then maybe Propeciahelp is more fitting for you.
    How can you claim you’re rooting for me and then also tell me to go to PropeciaHelp??

  8. #388
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenSun View Post
    I really don't think no fap is your make or break thing when you are not even in the gym.
    I agree on that and I wasn’t expecting morning wood right now.

    I’m off to my HIIT and although I only went to the gym 3 times total this week, it’s at least trending in the right direction and next week it should be 6 times.

  9. #389
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    How can you claim you’re rooting for me and then also tell me to go to PropeciaHelp??
    If that's the only thing you can reply to by entire message, then I'm sorry but you can't look at yourself in the mirror. You know you're not on the protocol dude, you even edited your post where you said you had many huge stretches because you know it's not true. And to evaluate how long you have been doing the protocol, you can't add it all up over a 4 years period as you say.

    You have to hold yourself accountable. You need long stretches. It doesn't look like you even did a proper year of TMO. I have, and I'm not magically recovered. This thing take time AND work. It looks like you only have the first part right.

    And I agree with Golden.. Nofap is not even close to being as important diet, gym, herbs, meditation, cold showers. And I don't understand the fixation on morning wood either. If you want, you could try ball icing 10min morning and night. Me and other PFS guys are seeing good results with it morningwood-wise.

    I'm sorry for being direct, but you're super delusional so I have to tell it straight. I'm trying to help you, but you're not hearing what we're saying.

    I'm rooting for you to get real and change your attitude. But if you want to complain while doing nothing, yeah I think PH is more adequate for that.
    Last edited by Outlaw; 09-24-2022 at 02:39 PM.

  10. #390
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outlaw View Post
    If that's the only thing you can reply to by entire message, then I'm sorry but you can't look at yourself in the mirror. You know you're not on the protocol dude, you even edited your post where you said you had many huge stretches because you know it's not true. And to evaluate how long you have been doing the protocol, you can't add it all up over a 4 years period as you say.

    You have to hold yourself accountable. You need long stretches. It doesn't look like you even did a proper year of TMO. I have, and I'm not magically recovered. This thing take time AND work. It looks like you only have the first part right.

    And I agree with Golden.. Nofap is not even close to being as important diet, gym, herbs, meditation, cold showers. And I don't understand the fixation on morning wood either. If you want, you could try ball icing 10min morning and night. Me and other PFS guys are seeing good results with it morningwood-wise.

    I'm sorry for being direct, but you're super delusional so I have to tell it straight. I'm trying to help you, but you're not hearing what we're saying.

    I'm rooting for you to get real and change your attitude. But if you want to complain while doing nothing, yeah I think PH is more adequate for that.
    I did have multiple long stretches where I was doing the protocol — go back and read my thread if you’re curious, I’ve been here longer than just the last few posts. I have never shied away from what I have and haven’t done. I’ve been upfront the whole time, and I literally said that I’ve been off protocol. It’s not some big secret.

    I can look at myself in the mirror, I don’t know what you’re talking about. I am not "super delusional,” you’ve been consistently misinterpreting things that I say. It appears that I somehow offended you and now you’ve decided to antagonize me with your hostile and patronizing attitude. You’re the one with the attitude problem, you’re the one being disrespectful and hostile. Knock it off dude. And if you can’t — leave me alone.

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