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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cdsnuts View Post
    This is not following the protocol.

    It is very clearly outlined. If you guys want to change things around and pick and choose what part to implement, you're not doing yourself or anyone else any favors, especially recommending things that are NOT part of the regimen. This forum is not the place for that.
    Well, why I’m getting better results now that I quit exercises, too much test boosters and paleo diet? It can’t be a coincidence. Maybe it could help other people too if they have problems with their adrenals, I always got worse from fasting, from paleo diet, intermittent fasting. In my case it’s better to eat carbs basically in all meals but in less quantity.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brazilianguy View Post
    Well, why I’m getting better results now that I quit exercises, too much test boosters and paleo diet? It can’t be a coincidence. Maybe it could help other people too if they have problems with their adrenals, I always got worse from fasting, from paleo diet, intermittent fasting. In my case it’s better to eat carbs basically in all meals but in less quantity.
    Because I know for a fact you're not implementing 100% of the protocol. This is an all or nothing endevour, anything less isn't going to work. If you're not going to do what everyone else has been doing, and recovering, then I guess there is nothing much more here for you. I certainly can't have you giving advice to new people who are already confused and scared, especially when that advice isn't correct.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  3. #33
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    Hi guys, I'm doing an update. Yesterday was a bad day for him he had his 6th session of Deep TMS and he had a panic attack before doing it , he has been having face numbness after starting this and has not had erections, when he finished the session and felt like a ghost and could barely speak, I´m also wondering if this could also be do the fact that he took Tribulus 7 days ago and crashed, the Deep TMS starts showing its effects around the 10th session.
    Please let me know your and thoughts.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kate View Post
    Hi guys, I'm doing an update. Yesterday was a bad day for him he had his 6th session of Deep TMS and he had a panic attack before doing it , he has been having face numbness after starting this and has not had erections, when he finished the session and felt like a ghost and could barely speak, I´m also wondering if this could also be do the fact that he took Tribulus 7 days ago and crashed, the Deep TMS starts showing its effects around the 10th session.
    Please let me know your and thoughts.
    Hi Kate - sorry to hear that. No doctor here, but we're on our own until PFS (Post Finasteride Syndrome) actually gets recognised. At the moment, doctors don't know what to do with us, and there probably isn't much they could do instantly to fix us even if it were recognised. Depression is what many will put this down to, because it appears to them to *mostly* fit that bill, and they *mostly* know how to treat that one - so that's what you'll be told. Depression though is an all-too-common symptom of PFS, and not the problem itself.

    I'm not sure I'd suggest carrying on with this or not. But what I would do is get started as swiftly as possible on the protocol. It's going to be hard work, and REALLY unfair at the beginning as that's when you have to put the most effort in whilst personally feeling the worst!

    But around here, this is what we do. And we have success. Some recover slowly, some in mere months, but it's a well-respected regime on here, Hackstasis, Ray Peat etc.

    Your very very best bet is getting started on the protocol. As much of it as you can at the start, but definitely be doing all of it within a few weeks.

    Can your son sign up and post here?

  5. #35
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    I’m sorry to hear that your son is going through all these hardships.

    I do think he has PFS, but unfortunately TMS treatments will not cure PFS. His problem is not standard depression, but the doctors tend to consider this a depression or anxiety issue because that’s what they have treatments for.

    I think your son’s immediate priority should be to stabilize his emotions as much as he can (meditate, maybe talk to a therapist) and start getting decent sleep. It’s hard to do anything if you’re not sleeping.

    I don’t think taking tribulus would give him a panic attack 7 days later. I think he’s having panic attacks because he’s terrified of his symptoms and is thinking he will never be normal again, etc.

    He just needs to first, accept that this is what he has, understand that it is reversible if he puts in the work, and also that PFS does not pose a threat to his life. He needs to be able to calm down and relax, and not be in a constant state of panic. Nobody can be cured until they have calmed down (but being calm is not enough to cure someone by itself.)

    Once he’s able to sleep a bit more, and isn’t panicking so much, he can start the program more fully. I would especially focus on sleep and exercise. The herbal supplements will not cure him alone - it only works as part of a broader program.

    He should keep in mind that it will take time to heal. In the meantime I hope he can get the panic under control. I’m not sure if the TMS treatments will help his mood, but depression is really a symptom here, not the cause.

    If he goes down the doctor route, he will wind up on tons of different drugs and it tends not to cure anyone of PFS, unfortunately.

    The good news is that even if he didn’t have PFS, the program would still be helpful to him. I don’t think you have to believe in PFS to be helped by the program, just don’t get caught up in testosterone injections and all these other treatments that do not help PFS.

  6. #36
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    As I said before, I highly encourage everyone to look into Dr. JACK KRUSE´s work (google it). As I see it right now, he is the best doctor in the world I am aware of. He recommends many things cdnuts does, but he also goes into huge detail. I think details are very important in some cases. I have to say that I really like most of the things in the cdnuts protocol, but I have my doubts about some of them. For example, I have read information that fasting, though very useful in some cases, could be a bad idea to someone who is very sick (if you stress to much an already stressed/ sick system it could break. Some stress could be good, to much not).

    Another one is SUN exposure, but there are specific ways to obtain maximum benefits and minimum drawbacks from it. You should expose the most amount of the body as possible AND do not cover your eyes with sunglasses, glasses or, especially contact lenses. You should do that especially first time in the morning and later in the evening when there is less UV content in order to allow the body to build a "sollar callus", that is, to be able to absorb the more UV content during midday. I would also expose the body during midday, but initially not much time, increasing time exposure GRADUALLY and depending upon things like skin tone and solar power of the season / location.

    This may all sound weird at first, but think about it, we humans evolved during hundreds of thousands of years with certain environmental commonalities, which would make our bodies more responsive to certain conditions:

    1-Diet: That is why I think a Paleo Diet is great. But there are also details here, which I won´t go to much into. I´ll just say that we evolved to eat SEASONALLY and DEPENDING UPON LOCATION. That is in low light and cold environments you are probably adapted to eat ketogenic (high quality fats) and not high carb, and the opposite would be true during strong solar cycles.

    2-Light: This is the biggest healing factor IMO, for what I´ve read and experienced. It is directly tied to CIRCADIAN RYTHMS. We evolved under the Sun, not under artificial LED/ fluorescent / incandescente bulbs (even though the last ones are a bit better, with less blue content and a more balanced spectrum, more similar to the Sun). So... I´ll spend lots of time outdoors during the day and at nighttime I would use BLUEBLOCKER GLASSES (search in google, any biohacker now knows why this is important, blue light at night from artificial screens and even light bulbs stops your melatonin secretion = you don´t have restorative sleep = you don´t heal, or you do it much slower).

    3- Temperature: Cold exposure is also benefitial, but especially in low light cycles... It is all tied together, like an orchestra.

    Sun exposure + mindfulness meditation saved my life. It got me out of the hole of depression and emotional roller coaster.

    There will be hundreds of suggestions in the internet and it is super easy to get overwhelmed, I still do sometimes. It is important to get priorities. I would prioritize: 1- Sunlight during the day and avoiding and blocking artificial light during the night (CIRCADIAN RYTHM OPTIMIZATION, google this) 2-Meditation or some sort of relaxation technique, as well as walking and spending LOTS OF TIME IN NATURE. 3- Avoiding nnEMF´s (excessive mobile phone usage, wifi, or leaving near cell phone towers or high voltage power lines... Yeah this sucks, but I also think it´s huge). 4-Eating a Paleo Diet, but also tied to circadian cycles (e.g. try to eat mostly during daytime and nothing or little during nighttime. This is also what we are designed to do. 5-Try "earthing": Google it, there are many reports and several studies about this, I realize this also seems a bit far out there but there is science behind. Did you know Lance Amstrong did this?Could walking barefoot on grass improve your health? Some research suggests it can. - The Washington Post 6-Last but not least, be kind with your Sun and try to be empathetic and understand his situation. It is hard, very hard. But there is a lot of hope too. Life can be good again

    All the best,

    Pablo.

    PD: Another thing that I don´t totally agree with is exercising in a gym. Yeah... I loved the gym. But lately I´ve been exercising outdoors and it feels much better. There is an explanation for this which comes back to light effects, we can discuss it in the future. Right now I´m doing calisthenics, sprints and a bit of cardio with lots of nature walking. But to someone like this young man who is quite sick I wouldn´t recommend netiher fasting nor extrenous exercises, I think it could be too much stress to the body. When he gets a bit better... maybe yes. RECONNECT WITH NATURE!!!

    I say all this and I´m 90% recovered, not 100%, but in the last few months I switched a little bit the protocol to this and I´m seen good results. I hope to report in 1-2 months and say I´m 100%, I see it very plausible. We are all in this together... come on!!

  7. #37
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    He took 3 pills all at once of a super strong tribulus. He forgot to put here.

  8. #38
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    I would always go natural!!! Panick attacks are normal I think, they suck for sure... I got totally rid of them during the first summer of recovery with lots of times outdoors in the sun + meditation.

    It worked like magic for me, it was hard to believe... it is about balancing neurotransmitters in the brain, there are lots of studies about meditation changing brain wave activity and neurotransmitter status. Also sunlight through the skin and the eye creates dopamine... feel good hormone. It does many other things... Just don´t look directly to the Sun, especially midday or you´ll get blind... (no bueno), but rather let the sun rays get PERIPHERICALLY through the retina. It builds intraocular MELATONIN (e.g sleep and repair hormone) and also dopamine. Try also to stay away as much as you can from screen devices (get your BLUEBLOCKER GLASSES read this!!!) and excessive technology usage.

    I know all this things may sound weird, but if you have doubts about this: 1-Try it, it won´t hurt 2-Check J Kruse´s explanations... he goes deep 3-Ask me and I can (or I think so) find you some studies or references...

  9. #39
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo View Post
    As I said before, I highly encourage everyone to look into Dr. JACK KRUSE´s work (google it). As I see it right now, he is the best doctor in the world I am aware of. He recommends many things cdnuts does, but he also goes into huge detail. I think details are very important in some cases. I have to say that I really like most of the things in the cdnuts protocol, but I have my doubts about some of them. For example, I have read information that fasting, though very useful in some cases, could be a bad idea to someone who is very sick (if you stress to much an already stressed/ sick system it could break. Some stress could be good, to much not).

    Another one is SUN exposure, but there are specific ways to obtain maximum benefits and minimum drawbacks from it. You should expose the most amount of the body as possible AND do not cover your eyes with sunglasses, glasses or, especially contact lenses. You should do that especially first time in the morning and later in the evening when there is less UV content in order to allow the body to build a "sollar callus", that is, to be able to absorb the more UV content during midday. I would also expose the body during midday, but initially not much time, increasing time exposure GRADUALLY and depending upon things like skin tone and solar power of the season / location.

    This may all sound weird at first, but think about it, we humans evolved during hundreds of thousands of years with certain environmental commonalities, which would make our bodies more responsive to certain conditions:

    1-Diet: That is why I think a Paleo Diet is great. But there are also details here, which I won´t go to much into. I´ll just say that we evolved to eat SEASONALLY and DEPENDING UPON LOCATION. That is in low light and cold environments you are probably adapted to eat ketogenic (high quality fats) and not high carb, and the opposite would be true during strong solar cycles.

    2-Light: This is the biggest healing factor IMO, for what I´ve read and experienced. It is directly tied to CIRCADIAN RYTHMS. We evolved under the Sun, not under artificial LED/ fluorescent / incandescente bulbs (even though the last ones are a bit better, with less blue content and a more balanced spectrum, more similar to the Sun). So... I´ll spend lots of time outdoors during the day and at nighttime I would use BLUEBLOCKER GLASSES (search in google, any biohacker now knows why this is important, blue light at night from artificial screens and even light bulbs stops your melatonin secretion = you don´t have restorative sleep = you don´t heal, or you do it much slower).

    3- Temperature: Cold exposure is also benefitial, but especially in low light cycles... It is all tied together, like an orchestra.

    Sun exposure + mindfulness meditation saved my life. It got me out of the hole of depression and emotional roller coaster.

    There will be hundreds of suggestions in the internet and it is super easy to get overwhelmed, I still do sometimes. It is important to get priorities. I would prioritize: 1- Sunlight during the day and avoiding and blocking artificial light during the night (CIRCADIAN RYTHM OPTIMIZATION, google this) 2-Meditation or some sort of relaxation technique, as well as walking and spending LOTS OF TIME IN NATURE. 3- Avoiding nnEMF´s (excessive mobile phone usage, wifi, or leaving near cell phone towers or high voltage power lines... Yeah this sucks, but I also think it´s huge). 4-Eating a Paleo Diet, but also tied to circadian cycles (e.g. try to eat mostly during daytime and nothing or little during nighttime. This is also what we are designed to do. 5-Try "earthing": Google it, there are many reports and several studies about this, I realize this also seems a bit far out there but there is science behind. Did you know Lance Amstrong did this?Could walking barefoot on grass improve your health? Some research suggests it can. - The Washington Post 6-Last but not least, be kind with your Sun and try to be empathetic and understand his situation. It is hard, very hard. But there is a lot of hope too. Life can be good again

    All the best,

    Pablo.

    PD: Another thing that I don´t totally agree with is exercising in a gym. Yeah... I loved the gym. But lately I´ve been exercising outdoors and it feels much better. There is an explanation for this which comes back to light effects, we can discuss it in the future. Right now I´m doing calisthenics, sprints and a bit of cardio with lots of nature walking. But to someone like this young man who is quite sick I wouldn´t recommend netiher fasting nor extrenous exercises, I think it could be too much stress to the body. When he gets a bit better... maybe yes. RECONNECT WITH NATURE!!!

    I say all this and I´m 90% recovered, not 100%, but in the last few months I switched a little bit the protocol to this and I´m seen good results. I hope to report in 1-2 months and say I´m 100%, I see it very plausible. We are all in this together... come on!!
    In regards to your doubts, fasting can be argued either way, and both sides have merit. When in doubt, Juice feast. Regardless this doesn't change my recommendations simply because of my experiences with this part of the protocol. But you need to clarify something. One of the other things you had doubts about was sun exposure yet you went on to tout the benefits of it? It didn't come across very clear. I recommend gradual exposure starting in April (if you live in the North East) to build what you call a "solar callous." So you're basically agreeing with these recommendations. I don't see how this comes across as doubt.

    Lastly, I have no problems with people saying pretty much whatever they want on this forum as I am an advocate for free speech, as long as it's helpful to those that are here. That being said, this forum is to discuss the TMO protocol. There are plenty of other places to discuss other things. This just isn't one of them. I personally haven't looked into this doctor that you're mentioning here, and have mentioned plenty of other times before, but if he is saying the same things I am saying, then I guess it's close enough to be okay. Point is, this is hard enough without watering things down and giving people too many options to choose from.

    We know for a fact that the protocol works, so that's where I want to keep the focus. As always, thank you for your contributions as they are typically very detailed and for the most part, spot on.

    Congrats on your progress thus far as well.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

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