User Tag List

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 29
  1. #11
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Swill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    280
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Turnover25 View Post
    Weird stuff, man. I’ll give you my 2 cents.

    If your desired never returned, I’d have a suspicion that you truly weren’t “out of the woods” so to speak completely. Maybe you deemed yourself “good enough” and moved on. The medication could have tripped you up a bit if that were the case, not really sure. But anxiety and panic are a thing for normal everyday people, just reading this gave me a bit of fight or flight, so I’d dissect your current life and see if there are any psychological stressors at play.

    I was primarily a neurological victim of PFS. Anxiety, panic and inability to handle simple tasks and getting completely overwhelmed by just doing shit like vacuuming my house was a huge, HUGE issue for me. Total nightmare, I get it. But I can assure you it passes. It did for me, and I’ve crashed myself like 3 times with 5ARI’s over my course of this. So even if it has anything to do with PFS, which it probably doesn’t, you’ll be fine either way.

    Curious what @Cdsnuts and @Maxout777 thoughts are here

    Edit: the more I read this thread, it sounds like a pfs crash. There’s plenty of stories where guys have crashed years later. And my crystal ball with the sides you’re describing was the protocol for a few months, then running a pro hormones cycle. All that BS left after my first cycle and it was a lot easier.

    Not to be a dick but I’m not sure what all the random supplement suggestions are about, a lot of guys here didn’t deal with hardcore neurological shit and playing with supplements can seriously fuck you in that department, you don’t want to play with fire. It’s not the same as low libido where you take the wrong supplements and don’t feel horny anymore, if you take something your body doesn’t agree with you’re going to send yourself into a nightmare that you don’t want any part of
    In terms of moving on after being 'good enough,' I hear you but I can assure you I was militant with the protocol over a number of years and got to the point where I felt great in every way aside from never recovering a full (although vastly improved) libido.

    I eventually put this down to the fact I had one functioning nut, which from a large number of blood tests I had only got to mid range (around 430 ng/dl). This was done whilst training like a demon, eating super clean, being in great shape, pro hormone and herb cycling and full compliance with the protocol. I figure that genetics as a result were against me being able to fully optimise and get over the line.

    Thats why I am now considering TRT as an option, there is a clinic here in the UK that does daily Test Cyp microdosing and HCG, which sounds like the best bet should that be the way to go.

    The inability to handle and be overwhelmed with basic tasks has been horrific, I've had a fear of leaving the house and been emotional over not feeling able to wash at points... horrific.

    Just wondering, when you had the neurological sides did you find they were at the worst in the morning and earlier part of the day, but tended to ease as the day goes on? Thats the one pattern I have noticed with this and its really puzzled me. The only thing I can think is its linked to my circadian rhythm with my brain overreacting to the cortisol release in the morning.
    WORK! CONSUME! DIE!

  2. #12
    Established Member Feedback Score 0
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Posts
    135
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Swill View Post
    Just wondering, when you had the neurological sides did you find they were at the worst in the morning and earlier part of the day, but tended to ease as the day goes on? Thats the one pattern I have noticed with this and its really puzzled me. The only thing I can think is its linked to my circadian rhythm with my brain overreacting to the cortisol release in the morning.
    For me personally this was exactly how it went down for me. Panic and anxiety attacks in the first half if the day and then i just felt really ill the latter half as if im came down from something. Then when night came around anxiety started again. But then this rhythm started to change over time so try not to overthink patterns.

  3. #13
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Swill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    280
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by TubZy View Post
    Magnesium and minerals/trace minerals in general. Majority of them increase GABA and having calming properties specifically magnesium and they all act in balance/with each other. If you want to use magnesium in isolation magnesium threonate is the most effective for brain issues. Mag chloride works to it just takes long to build up in saturation since it goes all over the body.

    Magnesium potentiation of the function of native and recombinant GABA(A) receptors - PubMed
    The Role of Magnesium in Neurological Disorders
    Treatment Of Magnesium-L-Threonate Elevates The Magnesium Level In The Cerebrospinal Fluid And Attenuates Motor Deficits And Dopamine Neuron Loss In A Mouse Model Of Parkinson’s disease
    Magnesium L-threonate prevents and restores memory deficits associated with neuropathic pain by inhibition of TNF-α - PubMed
    Cheers Tubzy, and good to hear from you! Remember you from the good old days!

    I'd been taking natural calm magnesium initially and had switched over to Magnesium Glycinate stacked with Taurine as I read this was the best bet for getting to the brain and calming effect. You'd shoot for Threonate over that?
    WORK! CONSUME! DIE!

  4. #14
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Swill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    280
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
    Actual anxiety disorders, if treated right will usually take anywhere from 1 to 2 years to go into remission, going of the literature I’ve read. That doesn’t mean it will be hell all the time ofc, as symptoms diminish and your brain learns to cope. I’m not in essence against ssri either, but you have to make out for yourself if it is the right choice for you personally. If, like me, you struggle with severe health anxiety and anxiety related to medication, I’d personally lay off em. And ofc sexual sides are a real and common possibility, with varying magnitudes of persistence.

    If I were you I’d start going ham with the protocol with a real focus on the mental game. See if you can get some good moments going and develop some confidence. Give it at least half a year or so and then make a decision about going on an ssri. Chances are your stages of grief have passed by then and you will feel empowered enough to tackle this with your own grit. Just having a plan b in the back of your mind might give you enough resilience to make plan a work.
    Thank you for all your input Mojo, I really appreciate it.

    I just really wish I knew what I was dealing with, regarding whether its a 'pure' anxiety disorder or whether it is linked to the PFS. Also quite nervous about being able to 'see it off' due to the genetic issues I mentioned, meaning I have a quite low ceiling and cant fully optimise my hormones... hence me considering the microdosing TRT regimen despite it being something I would much rather not have to go near.

    With me being 5 months deep in this, and although work have been great and understanding about this it will only be the case for a short while longer, feeling like I need to roll the dice on it.

    Thats why i'm even considering the stem cell therapy into the CSF as an outside bet, figured that although expensive its low risk in that the worst it will do is nothing.
    WORK! CONSUME! DIE!

  5. #15
    Established Member Feedback Score 0
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    651
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Swill View Post
    In terms of moving on after being 'good enough,' I hear you but I can assure you I was militant with the protocol over a number of years and got to the point where I felt great in every way aside from never recovering a full (although vastly improved) libido.

    I eventually put this down to the fact I had one functioning nut, which from a large number of blood tests I had only got to mid range (around 430 ng/dl). This was done whilst training like a demon, eating super clean, being in great shape, pro hormone and herb cycling and full compliance with the protocol. I figure that genetics as a result were against me being able to fully optimise and get over the line.

    Thats why I am now considering TRT as an option, there is a clinic here in the UK that does daily Test Cyp microdosing and HCG, which sounds like the best bet should that be the way to go.

    The inability to handle and be overwhelmed with basic tasks has been horrific, I've had a fear of leaving the house and been emotional over not feeling able to wash at points... horrific.

    Just wondering, when you had the neurological sides did you find they were at the worst in the morning and earlier part of the day, but tended to ease as the day goes on? Thats the one pattern I have noticed with this and its really puzzled me. The only thing I can think is its linked to my circadian rhythm with my brain overreacting to the cortisol release in the morning.
    I had an extreme anxiety reaction to doing simple tasks and getting overwhelmed, fear of leaving my house and kinda a general paranoia, waking up in the morning was the worst part, also night time my anxiety would become harsh again.

    This doesn’t mean you’re dealing with pfs though, a lot of anxiety disorders work like that, especially during the morning. I’d avoid TRT like the plague.

  6. #16
    A 1k Club Member Feedback Score 0 Maxout777's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    1,032
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Damn my man. This isn't what I wanted to read when I saw you make a post on here! I'm sorry to hear things have taken a downturn for you bro.

    Obviously I think you hit something that needs to be highlighted here, you have one functional gonad. This puts you at a disadvantage testosterone wise, and as much as I love herbs and the ability to boost T with them, if your facilities aren't there - it's going to be quite tough.

    Honestly, TRT is not a great long term solution. It can be with the right program dialed in correctly with additional supplementation, but obviously not super recommended here for reasons. I will say, in my personal opinion, it would not hurt to see if TRT helped your situation for a 8-week cycle (NOTE: I am only stating this due to Swill's previous recovery and his own testicular injury/issue. I would NOT say this for anyone here for PFS, thanks) or so to see if this alleviates some of your issues. You may have gotten out of the woods and now your body just isn't keeping up the production.

    There's also the route to look into of neurosteroids if you think PFS is still going to be an issue. But I'm personally a fan of attacking angles that seem to be the root cause of issues, and you have lower T, and existing issues in the gonadal department.

    Good to hear from you again man even if it isn't on good terms!
    There ain't no traffic along the extra mile.

    Never Quit.

  7. #17
    Established Member Feedback Score 0
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Posts
    135
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by HOPE View Post
    My man, my story does not highlight any stark differences from your story. I had a mild tendency to become anxious, to see the worst in potential outcomes, a drive for perfectionism, but that was it, really. I had a bit of a rough year living abroad for university, after I left home, but nothing to me stood out that I was going to develop an anxiety disorder. One night, as the stress racked, a Caffiene-binged week, and sleepless nights towards the start of the pandemic, and some mild disturbances, was enough to trigger an episode of depersonalization. I had a panic attack the morning after, and was held in severe fight or flight for months. I have heard this story, time and time again - it will always start unexpectedly, when you least expect it. I couldn’t leave the house without an overwhelming feeling of fear rearing it’s head. I spent my days reading and reading, about how and why anxiety happens, when what I should have been doing was… letting go of whatever I was afraid of.

    Eventually, fed up,I started to do all the right stuff, going out, eating better, and the sort, and started to see improvements. I went to the gym, enjoyed music, and everything was practically looking up, that is until I had a setback one day (of which I will highlight, that this pattern of thought of doing better, then falling back, then sabotaging your recovery plan is very much a symptom of anxiety itself), and went down the antidepressant route for 10 days… PSSD came right after. It has been an absolute hell, one makes me sit right now and hope I still had panic attacks, still worried about losing my mind. Certainly better, but that is beyond the case. You’re knowledgeable enough not to take anything that can mimic PFS, so that’s enough talk about PSSD.


    What I’m trying to say is this: it took me 6 months of hard work to be able to get a real 20 minute break from my anxiety. Indeed, in the way you talk - “could this still be PFS?” is no different than my “Am I developing Schizophreina, Bipolar?”, or “Am I having a heart attack?”. I think you should honestly, go for the TRT micro dose given your history - Low Testosterone can certainly cause these issues, though I am not sure to the extent you are describing. Honestly, you sound like me 6 months ago. Supplemented with CBT and other techniques. I have a great number of sources and tips for overcoming anxiety.

    I had all but resolved mine, from being straight up agoraphobic (yes, I wouldn’t leave the house. Doing the laundry was a task to be proud of) to living life again, but it was one set back that drove me to the antidepressant.
    It seems to be that these thoughts of wondering whether this is lasting PFS, 8 years after it was gone dormant, or if it could be due for low Testosterone, are anxious thoughts themselves. I was inclined to believe something was deeply wrong with me as well, but the truth is - I was just panicking, and before you know if, you’re in a negative loop. You’re not worried about anything, but worrying about being worried. Then you’re worried about worrying about being worried. It’s a never ending cycle, until you calm down. These are my 2 cents.
    I want to echo this. Anxious thought loops will make everything worse and should be dealt with as soon as you can. Meditation, CBT therapy and general pattern breaking, like exercise and chores, will be helpful.

    Thanks for sharing this HOPE, it mirrors my exact experience coming down. I always wondered how much of it was because of an anxiety disorder and what was PFS. In the end I will never know, but they might not be mutually exclusive anyway so there is no point thinking about it much anymore.

    The biggest takeaway from all of this is to let go. Don’t over analyze or look for causes, cures or explanations. Accept it for what is it and be ready to invite it into your life for a while. The sooner you can just let it be, you will start to feel improvements and moments of clarity, giving you more confidence and eventually the belief that it will all have an end at some point.

  8. #18
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Swill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    280
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Thank you for all your replies everyone. I can assure you there have been no DHT blocking products or anything used, as you can all imagine I am quite militant with what I put on my body.

    And Hope and Mojo, thank you for your replies... I certainly am not jumping to conclusions that this is definitively PFS related. Could be me struggling with my hormones, could be anxiety/depression... all I know is i've never known anything like it. I can very much relate to how you both felt at your worst in your posts.

    And I know exactly what you mean Hope when you talk about those racing thoughts. You mention about sources and tips for anxiety in your posts, and these would be gratefully received. I'm happy to give anything a try and appreciate the input.
    WORK! CONSUME! DIE!

  9. #19
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    93
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Swill View Post
    Thank you for all your replies everyone. I can assure you there have been no DHT blocking products or anything used, as you can all imagine I am quite militant with what I put on my body.

    And Hope and Mojo, thank you for your replies... I certainly am not jumping to conclusions that this is definitively PFS related. Could be me struggling with my hormones, could be anxiety/depression... all I know is i've never known anything like it. I can very much relate to how you both felt at your worst in your posts.

    And I know exactly what you mean Hope when you talk about those racing thoughts. You mention about sources and tips for anxiety in your posts, and these would be gratefully received. I'm happy to give anything a try and appreciate the input.
    This is just my input, but you can test yourself to see what's off that is causing the symptoms. We already know the common PFS chemistry patterns of what's off from everyone testing with ZRT lab, like low Glutamate, low GABA, low Allopregnanolone (and other hormones/neurosteroids) in CSF + serum (yet high in urine from high catabolism), low catecholamines, altered amino acid profiles, low acetylcholine, low IGF-1 (caused by low GH), etc.

    You can get test kits, if you want, at canaryclub.org and figure out what's wrong.

    You can also get straight Allopregnanolone for anxiety relief and potential pro-libido boost at idealabsdc.com/lab. A few PFS'ers have tried that out already and noted mild Xanax-like effects, since it binds to and agonizes GABAA receptors same as benzodiazepines/Xanax.
    Last edited by JoeP26; 07-29-2021 at 06:53 PM.

  10. #20
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Swill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    280
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeP26 View Post
    This is just my input, but you can test yourself to see what's off that is causing the symptoms. We already know the common PFS chemistry patterns of what's off from everyone testing with ZRT lab, like low Glutamate, low GABA, low Allopregnanolone (and other hormones/neurosteroids) in CSF + serum (yet high in urine from high catabolism), low catecholamines, altered amino acid profiles, low acetylcholine, low IGF-1 (caused by low GH), etc.

    You can get test kits, if you want, at canaryclub.org and figure out what's wrong.

    You can also get straight Allopregnanolone for anxiety relief and potential pro-libido boost at idealabsdc.com/lab. A few PFS'ers have tried that out already and noted mild Xanax-like effects, since it binds to and agonizes GABAA receptors same as benzodiazepines/Xanax.
    Thank you for this dude, it is much appreciated. I had heard of the ZRT testing but I wasn't sure if it was accurate/legit.

    Of note I had some 5a-DHP left over from years back, which I tried along with the protocol to see if it improved sexual function. I can't really remember it having any benefit in that regard, but I wasn't having any mental issues back then. CD actually recommended I give it a try again a couple days back and over the last two days my sleep has been a bit better and the anxiety has been a bit more muted, so I think it has had an effect. Far from a fix, but took the edge off a little.

    I read on the site you provided me a link to that allopregnanolone would be a fair better bet than 5a-DHP, and has fewer knock on effects and as a result they discontinued the 5a-DHP when the allo became available. I have ordered it and will certainly give it a go, thank you dude. Any idea what doses people have experimented with? I was taking 3mg of the 5a-DHP just before bed.

    Apologies but i'm very new to this neurosteroid stuff, all of my previous focus was on sex hormone levels initially and then on the protocol. Any idea if supplementing with allopregnanolone could lead to an upregulation naturally with time, or is it a 'band aid' approach?
    WORK! CONSUME! DIE!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •