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  1. #371
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    I’m late 30s, so not that young. I haven’t really found scientific studies showing anything about IF and androgen receptors, just claims on random websites that it helps.
    What I meant is that there are differing recommendations for feeding windows based on your age. So, for example, if you're between the ages of 30-40, you would do 12-12, between 40-50, 16-8, etc. FYI, I completely made those numbers up, but just using this to show you an example.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  2. #372
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cdsnuts View Post
    What I meant is that there are differing recommendations for feeding windows based on your age. So, for example, if you're between the ages of 30-40, you would do 12-12, between 40-50, 16-8, etc. FYI, I completely made those numbers up, but just using this to show you an example.
    Right, I gotcha. I haven’t been able to find anything like that broken down by age and backed by science. I’m sure there are random personal trainers with different advice, what would sway me would be a scientific study where they assigned men to different feeding times and recorded changes in their test, free test, etc. It would be even better if it was sub divided by age brackets to see if some windows are better at different ages, like you’re saying.

    My mom is in her early 70s and her doctor recommended eating noon to 8 pm only, although she’s not looking for hormone benefits, it’s safe at any age.

    I read Dr Fung’s first book on fasting and he doesn’t say that different ages have different ideal fasting windows. My takeaway was that more restrictive is better because you will have a stronger rebound when you eat again. However, he mostly writes about fasting and how it can reverse type II diabetes, help people lose fat, fix high blood pressure & get off the meds, etc. He doesn’t talk much or at all about building testosterone in his first book.

    I think a 21 day water fast is better than 14, is better than 7. Doesn’t matter if you are 25, 35, 45, etc, this holds true. I think it’s the same with IF (more restrictive is more powerful for everyone) but this is just an assumption. I will let you know if I find a breakdown like you described.
    Last edited by LetsGo; 08-30-2022 at 11:32 PM.

  3. #373
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 xxaleksi's Avatar
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    Yeah I felt like a whole new person after my 14 day fast a year ago. It fixed gut issues I had even before I knew what finasteride was or took it. I’ll probably do a 21 day one within the next five years or so but will probably go to a clinic to do it. I never really got into IF but recovered just fine without it.

    After my fast I slowly slipped back into a shitty diet and alcohol for a long time. Now I’ve been doing a keto/Dave Asprey style diet for a few weeks to boost my mitochondrial function and feel great. Along with most of the TMO protocol. I thought keto would make me feel like shit like it did in the past but so far I feel good.
    Last edited by xxaleksi; 08-31-2022 at 05:57 AM.

  4. #374
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
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    Hey xxaleksi. Just had two questions for you if you dont mind.

    1. I saw a comment of yours that you used to eat a lot of fruit. Were you not worried about it containing sugar and feeding bad gut bacteria?

    2. Were you still eating tomatoes/nightshades?

  5. #375
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    I’ve been having some better and worse feeling days this month. Need to reread the book about not fapping, since I do seem to fap when I feel signs of progress. My sensitivity was up significantly.

    Also going to do some sessions in an isolation float tank (no light or sound, and you float on special bouyant water so that you don’t feel any sensations either.) Some years ago I did this one time and it was pretty amazing, but I also read a study where they did 12 floats across 6 weeks and even 6 months later, their anxiety scores were still 1/3 lower. Pretty amazing, so I might do that. Stress and anxiety create cortisol which inhibits testosterone, also I don’t want to feel anxious.

    I’m not sure if it would be good to supplement with boron, and vitamin C with rose hips.

  6. #376
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    I believe boron increases free testosterone? I do not know the opinion of CDnuts, it should be interesting but if it is not part of the protocol there may be a reason. For anxiety, magnesium works well I find.

  7. #377
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    Last week I went to the gym a few times, this week (starting with Sunday) I’m aiming for the normal six days (4 lifting + 2 HIIT). I’m depressed — I get no joy from anything and don’t really look forward to anything.

    For some reason I have not been able to replicate the major progress I felt when I first started the protocol in 2019. Maybe that’s because when I started, I’d done a juice feast (albiet improperly) right before? I don’t know, it just seems like it always stalled or I didn’t make much sustained progress. Covid and not going to the gym was of course a huge factor, but there have been stretches where I feel like I was doing everything perfectly yet the upswings were not building on each other or expanding. I dont know.

    In late 2019, before I got mono, once I cut out gluten I was getting strong morning wood every day for weeks if I remember correctly. I have never been able to get back to that place.

    I am using the Joovv red light again on weekdays but haven’t noticed a difference so far. I’m considering going to a professional place once per week for a month since I read a guy on Reddit who says it increased his testosterone a lot. I’m desperate.

    I also found some guys on PropeciaHelp who did certain Buddhist breathing exercises or something that they say helped. I think there’s no reason not to try it, but I’m reluctant to do it because if it doesn’t work, one more ray of hope is gone.

    I don’t know what else to do. I’m going to be devastated if I don’t get an upswing soon after recommitting to the regular workouts. My sleep schedule is also very messed up. I just want to feel like I’m on track to be healed, and reach a place where I can feel more social and date and build some kind of life instead of just waiting to die.

  8. #378
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    Whatsup man,

    I understand where you're coming from, but I think you're too eager to see improvements.

    I did a 1 week fast in November, and it took me around 6 months before I saw sexual improvements. And for the first 4 months, I had 0 libido and 0 erections. It's weird looking back, but I honestly don't think I had an erection (natural or forced) for a good 3 months. At the 6 months mark, I saw some hints of libido that I never had, and had an overall more normal functioning. Point being, improvements can take a long time after a fast, and if I recall you did a 21 days, so it might take even longer for your system to reboot.

    And you say that last week you went to the gym a few times, and that this week you'll try to follow the normal schedule. How diligent have you been with exercise? I remember reading your story, and you said that you had huge stretches with no exercises, or inadequate diet. Since that's the case, you can't say ''man I've been at it for 3 years and still not recovered''.

    Except for when I was injured or super intolerant to exercise, I haven't missed a single day man. Every single week. And despite that discipline, my improvements are super slow. So if you're not super diligent with exercise, of course you won't see much.

    And regarding mindset, I understand where you're coming from all too well. I was doing the protocol, but I was looking at other random shit to recover, and telling myself ''well if TMO doesn't work I could always try that''. That's bullshit though, because it hinders how invested you are in the process. When you do something expecting results, you get better results than if you simply do it. If you're looking for ''other rays of hope'', it means you're not invested in the process enough. I made bigger gains at the beginning of my journey when I wasn't reading other theories, and when I saw TMO as my only way out. Now I've cut out all other theories/hopes and I'm all in mentally with TMO, and it's a weight off my mind. I still research a few things as additions to TMO, but not as things I invest ''hope'' in.

    If I were you, I would do 1 full year of absolute perfect TMO, with no breaks, no cheating, and no looking up other theories for hope. You say you had ''streches where you felt like you were doing everything''. You don't need stretches, you need miles of that shit. I

    And I would double down on meditation, hobbies and social relationships to heal the mind. That's another thing I struggle with. I was doing TMO absolutely perfectly, but I was reading online and wasn't seeing people. When I changed those things, it helped a lot, and it made me feel like a bit of normality had returned, even though my symptoms hadn't changed.

    Sorry for the tough love, that's how I see it and I don't care if you don't like it. You're super resilient man, you did a 21 days waterfast. If you could use that resiliency for a perfect 1 year and not stretches, I think you'd see results.

    Also, I would try to improve gut health. If you have money for a proper stool test like a GI-Map, I'd do that and work with a practioner to eradicate whatever bad stuff you find, to repopulate and balance your flora, and heal your gut lining. Every PFS guy has an impacted microbiome to a certain degree, and this has a huge effect on hormones/neurotransmitters/immune response/mitochondria. And this can happen despite having no classic gut symptoms. Some PFS guys recover simply by adressing their gut. I don't think it's that easy for everybody but nonetheless it's crucial to address, and a weight to lift off. I did the test and my gut is a complete mess. Despite that, I'm seeing slow results, so I can't believe how good TMO will feel once my gut is fixed.

    You got this man

  9. #379
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    In my experience, getting a better sleep schedule is very important. If you’re not sleeping during 1am-3am you’re missing out on a natural HGH spike that humans are designed to have every day. The whole summer I went to bed at 4am and it resulted in many healthy problems. Now I’m back to around 1:30am and it’s already an improvement, I’m aiming for 11am to be my normal sleep time, or should be yours too.

    The economy being in a recession seems to have everyone a little fucked up, I think there’s more pollution in the air as a result, at least where I live. Definitely a big difference from 2019. You’re not alone in your depression.

  10. #380
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    I’m not really sure how to proceed.

    In 2021 I did not have the same response to the protocol that I seemed to have in 2019 and I don’t know why. Doing the workouts and the herbs every day, it didn’t build up into anything. It didn’t build up towards recovery, and I’m not sure why. It feels like I might be immune to recovering or something.

    I have been depressed about the lack of PFS progress, but I’m getting back in the gym. (I did basically nothing in 2022 so it’s not a surprise that I made no progress.) I have these feelings of dread, that it will just be like 2021 where I’ll do all these workouts, take the herbal cycle, and not feel results. I’ll try the prohormones and they will feel like literally nothing, like they did in 2021.

    Do I need to do another water fast? Did my water feast “wear off” because I didn’t jump back into the herbs and workouts right after?

    I don’t know what to do anymore.

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