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  1. #31
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Hulk Smash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yus View Post
    Yeah, very thin. Extremely low body fat, 68kg currently and 185cm - Skin issues are a bit worrying because i develop a lot of pimples, weird moles that appears, gum boils. (Although some of these aren't very alarming) the frequency makes me wonder what's going on. I'm able to put on muscle, but weight gain is pretty challenging, and has been even before fin
    I figured you were probably very thin by your skin description. Because of the correlation, your skin lines are likely tied to your bone health. Did you have pimples, moles and gum boils prior to fin? Also, where are the moles and pimples located?

    Do you have a log? Please create one so we don't spam this log.

    Also, I think it may be beneficial for you to do Gua Sha. There are some good tutorials on YouTube.
    Last edited by Hulk Smash; 02-05-2020 at 11:06 PM.

  2. #32
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hulk Smash View Post
    Here since about 2016. My slow recovery has been my fault. I wasnt 100% all in. Many times I would slack on diet, lifting, sleep etc.

    Today I'm about 60-70% there and those improvements came VERY quickly when I stopped falling off for every doubt or setback.

    Stay on course or you will drag this out longer than need be.
    This post is what ALL the new guys should see. You should talk to the new guy @JoeP26 ....I just responded to his post something along these lines.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  3. #33
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
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    Update:

    4 months into the protocol, no improvements.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsRecover View Post
    Update:

    4 months into the protocol, no improvements.
    I find that hard to believe if I'm being honest

    No improvements whatsoever in any departments?

    You're telling me that you've gone in 100% after water fasting, eating super healthy, working out consistently, meditating and taking vitamins and nootropics,that you don't feel healthier, with more energy, better body composition, stronger,calmer and more mentally balanced?

    The only way you could have absolutely no improvements whatesover is if you've half arsed it while doing your best to convince yourself daily that it's all a waste of time and won't work. Because even if you did half arse it while having faith in what you're doing, you would still see a big difference.

  5. #35
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsRecover View Post
    Update:

    4 months into the protocol, no improvements.
    Then you are clearly either not doing the protocol are you're doing something wrong. It's that simple.

    It is biologically impossible to not have any improvement if you're doing everything 100% as outlined.....impossible. It goes against the laws of nature.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  6. #36
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alchemy View Post
    I find that hard to believe if I'm being honest

    No improvements whatsoever in any departments?

    You're telling me that you've gone in 100% after water fasting, eating super healthy, working out consistently, meditating and taking vitamins and nootropics,that you don't feel healthier, with more energy, better body composition, stronger,calmer and more mentally balanced?

    The only way you could have absolutely no improvements whatesover is if you've half arsed it while doing your best to convince yourself daily that it's all a waste of time and won't work. Because even if you did half arse it while having faith in what you're doing, you would still see a big difference.
    This^^^^^^^^^
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  7. #37
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
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    My symptoms are sexual (ED, no libido, no sensation) and insomnia. Sometimes my balls hurt. I have no or very little mental symptoms. Of course I am very depressed, but I think that's more because I lost my sexual life (used to love that), my job (can't work if I fall asleep), my social life (no alcohol, no fast food, no gluten) and life feels already over in my 20s.

    I can tell you what I have done the past 4 months and then maybe you can figure out what is the problem.

    Before I started I got tooth paste, shampoo, soap, laundry detergent, deodorant, hand cream from a shop in my city which sells itself as "all natural". I checked the ingrediants and there are no of the listed toxicants listed on TMO contained inside. Also they have no artificial flavours which I thought was a good sign.

    First 15 days juice feast. Only liquid juice out of fruits and greens (mainly spinach). This was brutal because after every drink I thought I had to puke (I asked for help there if you remember). But I did it and never puked when drinking slowly.

    Then I jumped immediately on the paleo diet (didn't know from TMO that you have to start slowly). I ate a lot of peppers, aubergines, zucchinis, meat, fish (salmon), tomatoes, dry figs, walnuts, lettuce, eggs, beans (appearently this is bad, so I stopped now with beans). I cooked everything with butter or olive oil. Every once a while a drank some milk. All organic.

    After the juice feast I immediately started lifting weights (I did that in the past already, I asked you if it is ok) 4 times a week (doing the letters A,B,C,D on TMO). Since then I did not skip one training. After 4 weeks I started lifting heavy and I started backloading. I started eating glutenfree pizza, pasta, sushi (took it with glutenfree soy sauce. Had no idea that soy was bad! Stopped soy by now), thai food and I went to restaurants again.

    I haven't had a sip of alcohol since starting the juice feast/protocol. Nor did I take any pharma when I was feeling sick.

    After lifting weights I take a glutenfree (they sell it as all natural) proteil shake (half a hour after, should prolong it to one hour after now).

    At least once a week I do HIIT sprints (at beginning 3 sprints, could not more. Now 5 sprints, then my knee starts to hurt. I had a surgery there). As soon I feel pain I stop which is most of the time after 5 sprints. I count an ice hockey match or practice as one HIIT training. This is why I sometimes only do HIIT once per week.

    After every workout (and everyday when I have a rest day) I take a cold shower. First warm, when I wash my hair with shampoo (because of the headache I get when my head gets cold water for too long. I think it is the same effect with eating very cold ice cream too fast.). Then all the way to cold. Also my head will be under the cold water, just for shorter periods.

    Every second day, I brush my skin with a brush under the cold shower.

    The first 3 months I only had sex with my gf, never masturbated, never porn. The last month I got a bit more careless in heavy downswings.

    After 1.5 months I started taking the daily supplements (vitD, Magnesium, one day spirulina, the other day chlorella). After 2.5 months (or so, don't remember the exact time) I got 13 herbs to cycle. Every day I take exactly one herb (some people take pine pollen daily which to me contradicts the principle of cycling stated on TMO).

    When its shiny outside I get some sunlight. I never got sunlight on my balls because I life in the city and people would definitely see that (how do you guys do that?).

    The only thing I was a bit careless about was meditation and breathing. I am sure you will say that's the problem. I do it every once in a while but definitely not daily. I downloaded holosync and started doing half a hour of listening to it. I just can not focus and its uncomfortable and boring. I do it twice or once a week when I feel stressed out. Maybe can I reduce it to 15 minutes per day? Or is 30 minutes necessary?

    So I would say I follow the protocol (yes, meditation I can improve on) very closely. The amount of time and energy it takes me are huge and the benefits (so far only a bit of muscles maybe) are slim/nonexistant. Maybe you like working out and being healthy, but I don't! I want to be lazy again, read, study, make music, eat shitty food like mcdonalds, eat baguettes, get drunk with friends. I like sports like tennis and ice hockey, but I do not enjoy working out. I can live with not being alpha.

    I do this all just to recover and as I said, I am willing to do anything to get there. Would be nice to get more guidance since so far I don't feel like I got much help out of this forum and of you experienced guys. And my trust is weak in everybody after asking 3 doctors about finasteride and they all tell me it is very good. Additionally, as you know everybody (even on hackstasis) debate your protocol. All I am trying to say is that it is just hard to know what is the truth in this situation.

    Have a good day! If this post was offensive to anybody of you, I am sorry, it was not my intention.
    Last edited by LetsRecover; 02-29-2020 at 08:52 AM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsRecover View Post
    My symptoms are sexual (ED, no libido, no sensation) and insomnia. Sometimes my balls hurt. I have no or very little mental symptoms. Of course I am very depressed, but I think that's more because I lost my sexual life (used to love that), my job (can't work if I fall asleep), my social life (no alcohol, no fast food, no gluten) and life feels already in my 20s.

    I can tell you what I have done the past 4 months and then maybe you can figure out what is the problem.

    Before I started I got tooth paste, shampoo, soap, laundry detergent, deodorant, hand cream from a shop in my city which sells itself as "all natural". I checked the ingrediants and there are no of the listed toxicants listed on TMO contained inside. Also they have no artificial flavours which I thought was a good sign.

    First 15 days juice feast. Only liquid juice out of fruits and greens (mainly spinach). This was brutal because after every drink I thought I had to puke (I asked for help there if you remember). But I did it and never puked when drinking slowly.

    Then I jumped immediately on the paleo diet (didn't know from TMO that you have to start slowly). I ate a lot of peppers, aubergines, zucchinis, meat, fish (salmon), tomatoes, dried figs, walnuts, lettuce, eggs, beans (appearently this is bad, so I stopped now with beans). I cooked everything with butter or olive oil. Every once a while a drank some milk. All organic.

    After the juice feast I immediately started lifting weights (I did that in the past already, I asked you if it is ok) 4 times a week (doing the letters A,B,C,D on TMO). Since then I did not skip one training. After 4 weeks I started lifting heavy and I started backloading. I started eating glutenfree pizza, pasta, sushi (took it with glutenfree soy sauce. Had no idea that soy was bad! Stopped soy by now), thai food and I went to restaurants again.

    I haven't had a sip of alcohol since starting the juice feast/protocol. Nor did I take any pharma when I was feeling sick.

    After lifting weights I take a glutenfree (they sell it as all natural) proteil shake (half a hour after, should prolong it to one hour after now).

    At least once a week I do HIIT sprints (at beginning 3 sprints, could not more. Now 5 sprints, then my knee starts to hurt. I had a surgery there). As soon I feel pain I stop which is most of the time after 5 sprints. I count an ice hockey match or pracitce as one HIIT training this is why I sometimes only do HIIT once per week.

    After every workout (and everyday when I have a rest day) I take a cold shower. First warm, when I wash my hair with shampoo (because of the headache I get when my head gets cold water for too long. I think it is the same effect with eating very cold ice cream too fast.). Then all the way to cold, also my head will be under the cold water, just for shorter periods.

    Every second day, I brush my skin with a brush under the cold shower.

    The first 3 months I only had sex with my gf, never masturbated, never porn. The last month I got a bit more careless in heavy downswings.

    After 1.5 months I started taking the daily Supplements (vitD, Magnesium, one day spirulina, the other day chlorella). After 2.5 months (or so don't remember the exact time) I got 13 herbs to cycle. Every day I take exactly one herb (some people take pine pollen daily which to me contradicts the principle of cycling stated on TMO).

    When its shiny outside I get some sunlight. I never got sunlight on my balls because I life in the city and people would definitely see that (how do you do that?).

    The only thing I was a bit careless about was meditation and breathing. I am sure you will say that's the problem. I do it every once in a while but definitely not daily. I downloaded holosync and started doing half a hour of listening to it. I just can not focus and its uncomfortable and boring. I do it twice or once a week when I feel stressed out. Maybe can I reduce it to 15 minutes per day? Or is 30 minutes necessary?

    So I would say I follow the protocol (yes meditation I can improve on) very closely. The amount of time and energy it takes me are huge and the benefits (so far only a bit of muscle maybe) are slim/nonexistant. Maybe you like working out and being healthy, but I don't! I want to be lazy again, read, study, make music, eat shitty food like mcdonalds, eat baguettes, get drunk with friends. I like sports like tennis and ice hockey, but I do not enjoy working out. I can live with not being alpha.

    I do this all just to recover and as I said, I am willing to do anything to get there. Would be nice to get more guidance since so far I don't feel like I got much help out of this forum and of you experiences guys. And my trust is weak in everybody after asking 3 doctors about finasteride and they all tell me it is very good. And as you know everybody (even on hackstasis) debate your protocol. All I am trying to say is that it is just hard to know what is the truth in this situation.

    Have a good day! If this post was offensive to anybody of you, I am sorry, it was not my intention.
    Have you done the prohormones yet?

  9. #39
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    If your problems are mainly sexual it can take quite some time to be better. Even some of the recovered took a year or 2 too get decent libido.

  10. #40
    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0 alphacfi's Avatar
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    I am 14 months into the protocol and I can definitely guarantee you that it is doing work. I remember last January feeling like I was not even going to make it to the summer. My mental symptoms were so terrible I didn't think I could live another day if it continued. There was little improvements for me in the first 4 months. Even 6 months in I would have downswings that would rival the downswings I was experiencing in the beginning. It's hard for me to even remember now how terrible I was feeling back then. It's a dark place I don't allow my mind to meditate on quite yet. Luckily I kept a journal for the first 6 months and I'm looking forward to reading that maybe a year or two after I am totally healed. You have to keep with it. Keep grinding away. I remember I used to love working out but when I crashed all I wanted to do was lay on the couch and watch tv eating cheetos. Working out become a chore and it wasnt fun for me anymore. But I pushed through that and hit the gym almost every day and still do. The guys that recover had there doubts along the way as you read there stories but the one thing they all have in common is they continued to follow it and improvements came. Albeit slowwwly. I don't know why you even worry about the people saying the protocol doesnt work and that TMO is bull shit. I mean do you not believe any of the fellas in the recovery section? I kinda doubt they are all lying about being recovered. That doesn't make much sense to me.
    I am doing 90% better. Most days I am 90-100. And by the report you laid out, if you continue to do what you're doing, you will be there too. Doesn't look much different from what I am doing.

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