1st cycle, help with proper PCT

[O.N.]

As for kickstarting cycle, you can start with for example test prop, and you may even finish with test prop (or maybe some oral AAS to close gap between last shot and PCT you may have issues with test prop as well- but it will be for 2+2 weeks rather than 12) but wold still go with test e, really- rather than sustanon, also as I said earlier calculating start of PCT is difficult task and with sustanon its much much more difficult as there are too many variables.

And make sure that you run HCG during whole cycle (and not after) and stop 3-4 days before PCT.


As for your testosterone levels, will get back to it some time after PCT.

Why would you stop HCG during PCT? you are technically still on cycle until all the steroids clear your system enough to a point where they do not effect your natural production of testosterone. A typical 500mg test e per week cycle will stick around in your system for about 3 weeks post you last injection and during that entire time they will be effecting your natural testosterone production.

Additionally you said earlier above to use 250-300IU 3x per week of HCG, it has been found that 250IU 2x per week once it compounds in your system over several weeks actually equals 94% of a normal males LH output so taking anything more than that amount can and will cause over stimulation, in some cases it may not be a bad thing but it others it can be.

[JakkCity]

you'll be shutdown after only a few days on test. start hcg day 1.

Test E or C or P(my recommendation ) week 1-10. if using test P do 50 mg ed. if using test E or C, do 200 mg 2x per week.
hCG week 1-12 250iu MWF
Masteron week 7-12 150 mg MWF (450/wk). if you want to avoid pinning frequently do that, or pin ED with less volume for less discomfort.
I prefer aromasin for an AI, adex is fine too. i have realized that everyone seems to respond differently to different AI's, so dosing recommendations are tough. if using adex, i would do .25 to .5 mg ed to start, you may need more.

PCT:
week 13 and on...

Clomid: 25/25/25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5EOD
Aromasin: 12.5 mg MWF at the beginning and then taper down by feel
Toremifene (Optional): 60/60/40/40/20/20/0

check bloods 6 weeks after PCT. if your test is still in the shitter, run some superdrol for a few days or something and then go to the doctor and your test will be bottomed out and you can get on TRT lol

I'm not too "in touch" with HCG and total newb question. if your saying 250 3xs week, how much would i need to pick up? not sure the sizes they come in and/or price this runs. also Weekend I am not informed enough about aromasin. Any specific reason you like this over adex? just looking for opinions. Like I said, main thing to me, I want to put on size, and I understand I could lose some or all(depending on how hard I work to keep it) but most important to me, is having my test restored to what it at now or even more, and still being able to reproduce.. Also, you would run 7 weeks pct? Everywhere I have looked and read seems like the general consensus is 4. Not saying your wrong, cause I am new to all this, just would like to hear opinion. Personally I will do whatever to make sure I can get test back up and reproduce

[weekend]

because hCG is suppressive. i actually plan to drop hCG and begin clomid a week before i stop using my short esters as a bit of an experiment. but the last thing i'll be using will only be mast for a week or a bit more so it's not as suppressive as test and may allow some function to begin to return. biggest reason is i want stable levels of clomid right from the get go.

[weekend]

the PCT i have laid out would be very mild during the last 3 weeks. a taper of PCT drugs is beneficial as it doesn't send your body on a rollercoaster.

aromasin is a suicidal inhibitor (no estrogen rebound when stopping use), and doesn't effect lipid profile or libido as negatively as the reversible inhibitors do.

hCG comes in 5000 iu vials from our sponsor evolved, quality stuff. you won't need more than 2 or 3 vials.

- - - Updated - - -

i feel like most guys online are not well read enough and haphazardly parrot each other's info. they often seem to be setting themselves up for TRT sooner than later..

though i am fully aware at only 21 i myself am playing with fire..

[JakkCity]

Something I really like and what brought me to this page, is peoples input and advice. I like the fact unlike other forums, people are not pushing products, or click here for the best blah blah bullshit like other sites. Just basic straight-forward input. Not saying "Oh your on this?, well you need these 3 test boosters, and 600$ of other bullshit so your dicky dew will work again and be stronger and bigger than ever haha. Keep the input coming fellas, Love to hear other members input on PCT for a Test E/Masteron Cycle. And thanks for the quick replies! Check ya guys out tomorrow! And weekend, I wasn't putting you in the same column as others who push products so they can get bigger discounts for themselves like other forums!

[weekend]

also, don't use formastanzol or whatever, made by an idiot for idiots.

[JakkCity]

also, don't use formastanzol or whatever, made by an idiot for idiots.

Roger That!

[O.N.]

because hCG is suppressive. i actually plan to drop hCG and begin clomid a week before i stop using my short esters as a bit of an experiment. but the last thing i'll be using will only be mast for a week or a bit more so it's not as suppressive as test and may allow some function to begin to return. biggest reason is i want stable levels of clomid right from the get go.

HCG is suppressive to the hypothalamus and pituitary as it is taking their place and stimulating the testes to make testosterone, that isn't a bad thing when steroids are still circulating in your system, you should be using it whilst there are drugs still effecting natural testosterone production.

Do you go as fast as you can in your car when you are about to run out of gas? or do you cruise around easy until you find a gas station?

Whilst ever there are steroids present in your body at a level high enough to suppress testosterone you should be using HCG, once you say stop using test e then about 2-3 weeks later you can drop the HCG and the half life of the HCG will clear along with most of the remaining esters from what you have been taking, thus you will have a smooth transition from on cycle to off cycle.

Once the bodies testosterone levels dip slightly the hypothalamus and pituitary will release GNRH and LH/FSH almost straight away and your normal function will remain.

This part now is probably a whole other topic but have a think about the word SERM's eg nolva and clomid (selective estrogen receptor modulator's) selective meaning in some receptor sites it blocks estrogen from binding and in others it will not thus it does not remove estrogen from the body. So you blocked it in your breast receptor site and the hypothalamus but now it is free and in more abundance to go and run havoc on the rest of the body, stick with low dose AI's since they actually remove estrogen from the body compared to SERM's.

[Jelisej]

Weekend made some excellent posts, unbeleivable how much knowledge he posses at only 21
only thing I would change a bit is injection frequency- test prop every day, or test e 3X a week, to keep more stable levels.

O.N.- I think you did not understand my post properly- as for HCG I did say stop 3-4 days before PCT and Weekend explained why it should not be used during PCT
I did not say how long till cessation of test e to start PCT- because I did not have exact details, and for example if one person is using 500 mg of test e and other one is using 600 mg of test e- their PCT will not start same time even tough they are using same compound.
I did suggest using some oral to "close gap" between last test e injection and PCT- which is good idea, IMO

Anyway- if he calculates everything properly, as you said recovery should be start immediately, tough how long it will take his endocrine system to top up levels is unknown- especially that we know that his test is already low- it is possible that his testosterone will be higher on PCT than natural
but it is possible that PCT will not work that well for him as he may be have "congenital" hypogonadism

Formula for calculating eliminating time:
1/1 100
1 1/2 50
2 1/4 25
3 1/8 12 .5
4 1/16 6 .25
5 1/32 3 .125
6 1/64 1 .563
7 1/128 0 .781

And on top of that there are some other circumstances that can affect elimination time- for example elimination time for one patient using xanax- half life was 15 hours but total elimination time was around 7 days- tough in most people after 24 hours there is no significant "action" as mostly there are left inactive metabolites- but under some circumstances it can stay active for much longer time

Another interesting case is with T3 (thyroid supplementation) as we know cortisol is needed to make use of T3 if there is no sufficient cortisol it will just "pool" in the blood- however if we introduce cortisol it will became active, and if there is too much unused T3 then patient usually ends up in ER because of "thyroid storm"- now T3 has a half life of 2.5 days yet people had "thyroid storm" sometimes almost two weeks after stopping T3, which proves that "stuff" can accumulate and stay in blood lot longer than people would think.

[ExtraZeus]

Just curious about the clomid dosage that's been recommended. 100/50/50/25 ed is what I've always read, I think it's even in a sticky that way. Is this something new, run clomid longer at a lower dose to reduce sides or is it a better recovery?

Thanks in advance.