Clomid & Nolva PCT

[weekend]

Yo jel, I have tadalafil... Is Viagra preferable for pct?

[Jelisej]

.. Is Viagra preferable for pct?

Not really, in some studies they used other PDE5 inhibitors with good results, so its not neccessary viagra.
From anecdotal evidence, all are good to go. Lot of people prefer levitra, as it gives them less sides. Taladafil has advantage of longer half-life.
Here is the study that says taladafil is better, but (IMO) study was bunk, as they did not take taladafils longer half-life in account.


Type V phosphodiesterase inhibitor treatments for erectile dysfunction increase testosterone levels.Carosa E, Martini P, Brandetti F, Di Stasi SM, Lombardo F, Lenzi A, Jannini EA.
Department of Experimental Medicine, University of L'Aquila, L'Aquila, Italy.

OBJECTIVE: Lack of sexual activity due to erectile dysfunction (ED) decreases testosterone (T) levels through a central effect on the hypothalamic-pituitary axis. In this paper we studied the effect of different type V phosphodiesterase (PDE5) inhibitor treatments for ED on the reversibility of this endocrine pattern. DESIGN: Open-label, retrospective study. PATIENTS: Seventy-four consecutive patients were treated on demand with sildenafil (Sild) (50 mg) and tadalafil (Tad) 20 mg. MEASUREMENTS: The success in sexual intercourse was recorded and total (tT) and free testosterone (fT) levels were studied before and after 3 months of treatment. RESULTS: Basal level of tT and fT were at the bottom of the normal range and LH levels were at the top of the high normal range. After treatments, this endocrine pattern was reversed in both groups. However, the T increase in Sild-treated patients was significantly lower than in those treated with Tad (4.7 +/- 2.7 vs. 5.1 +/- 0.9, P < 0.001). fT levels followed a directly proportional pattern, while the inverse was found when LH production was studied. The intercourse rate reflected this effect: in fact, the Sild group showed a 4.9 +/- 2.9/month full sexual intercourse rate while in the Tad group a significantly higher rate of sexual intercourse was found (6.9 +/- 4.6/month, P = 0.04). However, drug consumption was comparable between the groups (Sild 4.9 +/- 2.9 vs. Tad 4.4 +/- 2.8 pills/month, P = 0.72). CONCLUSIONS: As it is unlikely that the two drugs have a different direct effect on the pituitary-testis axis, this effect is probably due to the higher frequency of full sexual intercourse in the Tad-treated group, because of the drug's longer half-life.

[markam]

Apparently Viagra gives great pumps taken before a workout, but probably best to only do this if you work out at home, Lol.

@Jelisej, re the clomid restart dosing, 25mgs Ed was used for 6 weeks. I think you said that you preferred Nolva, so what would you say the equivalent dosage of Nolva is compared to 25mgs Clomid?

[Jelisej]

I cannot find anything among my paperworks, but f I remember correctly, clomid needs to be dosed around 4-5 times more than tamoxifen, so I would say 5 mg of tamoxifene would be comparable to 25 mg of clomid.
Typically no more than 10 mg of nolva per day, or 20 eod is needed. Lot of people boost their test. levels with 5mg of tamoxifen a day, so 10 mg a day will definitely suffice.
You can mix clomid and tamoxifen as you wanted in first place, no problem.

[markam]

Update.

Run Clomid @25mgs and Nolva @10mgs for 5 days. My eyes feel what best can be described as bleary and 'scratchy', and I have a sort of tension headache.
I dropped the Nolva and symptoms have lessened. So now I am thinking of running PCT as follows:

Wk1 Clomid 25mgs
Wk2 Clomid 25mgs
Wk3 Clomid 12.5mgs
Wk4 Clomid 12.5mgs EOD / Nolva 10mgs
WK5 Nolva 10mgs
WK6 Nolva 10mgs

I got the idea of starting with Clomid and finishing with Nolva from Datbtrue. BTW He thinks Toremefine is hype!

I noticed that he uses or has used DAA with Clomid, but that might not be a good idea? I need to research that.

[markam]

@ jelisej, You mention that Nolva is about 4-5 times stronger than clomid, so in my 4th week of pct I will do 12.5mgs Clomid eod and 10 mgs Nolva eod then in week 5&6 10mgs Nolva ed. Clomid is def working at 12.5mgs but is 10mgs enough for Nolva?

Edit. Just read your previous post where you state 10mgs is enough

[Jelisej]

Yeah, 10 mgs is enough, 5 mg would probably suffice. Anyway, 6weeks is ok, but maybe to extend for another 2weeks or so with 5 mg of nolva, as you are not that young....
As for DAA you asked earlier, at the moment I do not recommend it even in pct as it potentially can have sides, basically its potentially neurotoxic, plus from my experience sometimes it causes long term problem with prolactin.

[markam]

Yeah, 10 mgs is enough, 5 mg would probably suffice. Anyway, 6weeks is ok, but maybe to extend for another 2weeks or so with 5 mg of nolva, as you are not that young....
As for DAA you asked earlier, at the moment I do not recommend it even in pct as it potentially can have sides, basically its potentially neurotoxic, plus from my experience sometimes it causes long term problem with prolactin.

Cool.

I intended to do 6 weeks for the Serm/AI and a 7th week with my usual PCT dosage of Aromasin @ 12.5mg ed and the 8th week @ 12.5mg eod, so I'll just lengthen the whole cycle. This will mean that I'll be running aromasin for 9 weeks, is that ok?

Maybe do this, now:

WK 1-3 Clomid 12.5mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 4 Clomid 12.5 mgs eod / Nolva 10 mgs eod (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 5-6 Nolva 10 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 7-8 Nolva 5 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs eod)
WK 9 Aromasin 12.5 mgs eod.

Should I run Aromasin solo for 2 weeks or 1 week from week 9? Providing I don't get any E2 sides, 1 week should be plenty?

Thanks again for your invaluable help!

[Jelisej]

Maybe do this, now:
WK 1-3 Clomid 12.5mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 4 Clomid 12.5 mgs eod / Nolva 10 mgs eod (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 5-6 Nolva 10 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 7-8 Nolva 5 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs eod)
WK 9 Aromasin 12.5 mgs eod.

Does look allright, not sure about aromasin dosage and that can be tricky, try to gauge by symptoms (morning woods, mood changes etc) if you can, otherwise all seems good.

[markam]

Maybe do this, now:
WK 1-3 Clomid 12.5mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 4 Clomid 12.5 mgs eod / Nolva 10 mgs eod (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 5-6 Nolva 10 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs ed)
WK 7-8 Nolva 5 mgs ed (Aromasin 12.5mgs eod)
WK 9 Aromasin 12.5 mgs eod.

Does look allright, not sure about aromasin dosage and that can be tricky, try to gauge by symptoms (morning woods, mood changes etc) if you can, otherwise all seems good.

Jeez, it's never easy, is it. Lol.

Re aromasin, if I'm tolerating 12.5mgs ed ok, would it be best to keep to that dosage until maybe a week after discontinuing the Serm?