Saw Palmetto and Fenugreek...im in trouble!

[Freepressright]

@grapeape i already been to the urologist but they only told me there are more people who have this problem with accutane and they can't do much about it. And because accutane is also a 5 ar inhibitor i thought you guys could give me some advice on how to recover.

I agree with your doctors. They are an absolute dead end when it comes to treating problems from 5-AR inhibition. You might as well consult with the homeless dude on the corner.

Personally, I think any doctor who would prescribe this known genotoxin (former chemotherapy drug) needs a fist to the skull because this poison can literally ruin a man.

You need to go back and read the last few pages of this thread. Follow the same protocols that you see listed herein. It's your best chance at recovery.

[Pageidol]

Now then now then. These supplements, is it do i just sort of take em spaced out through the day or smash em all at once. I feel like a walking pharmacy haha. There any chance of these reacting with one another or will it be ok just to sort off take them together, ie tongkat alongside ahrawandha?

I must be taking 10 different things as i wake up.

Cheers

[Freepressright]

Now then now then. These supplements, is it do i just sort of take em spaced out through the day or smash em all at once. I feel like a walking pharmacy haha. There any chance of these reacting with one another or will it be ok just to sort off take them together, ie tongkat alongside ahrawandha?

I must be taking 10 different things as i wake up.

Cheers

I have a few things to share. Let me start with your dilemma.

I do not know of any of those reacting with one another. Ashwagandha, for example, is going to help regulate your cortisol levels, decrease your stress response, reset your adrenal glands and will have testosterone benefits. This is probably one of the most important herbs you're taking.

Now, with all these herbs, I'd recommend figuring out which ones to take daily and which ones to cycle. The ashwagandha is one of the ones, like pine pollen, that you take daily, especially in your condition. Some of the others you can cycle, and there are a few ways of doing it.

Cdsnuts does a multi-herb rotation, taking one of them one day and moving onto the next. But you can also partition your cycles to do like M, W, F - Tongkat Ali & Cistanche days and Tues and Thurs take herbs B and C, or D.

Or you could do your Tongkat 5 days on and 2 days off the first week to get your blood levels up, and then relinquish it to a Monday-Wednesday-Friday rotation. You'll just have to figure that out.

The idea is to keep surprising the body so you don't adapt and build a tolerance.

I recommend you read this article for more ideas on cycling:

How to Cycle Herbal Testosterone Boosters

Now, on to the next subject: Pine pollen powder.

I have always been a tincture user and have been happy. Cdsnuts and I talked through PM about the powder, which I've never tried. I have ordered two tinctures, but am waiting for them to arrive. Several months ago, a co-worker ordered a bag of the pollen but stopped taking it because she just doesn't like the taste.

Yesterday I asked if she still had it and if I could buy her bag. She ended up going and getting it on her lunch break and just gave it to me. I took 1 teaspoon and swished it around under my tongue and inside my mouth for about a minute (same principle as the tincture, and should work to some degree for androgen absorption since it's broken cell wall pine pollen from Super Man), then swallowed.

I repeated this a few hours later, and then did a whole tablespoon before bed.

I kid you not, I woke up a few times during the night, and every damn time I woke up, I had one of the best erections I've ever felt. I also awoke fully erect this morning, more so than usual.

I know the Super Man Herbs guy has a morning wood guarantee if you take enough of the powder. For me, it proved to be effective. But my tincture will be here Friday so I'm looking forward to all the nutritional benefits of the powder, combined with the concentrated androgens in the tincture.

I'll keep everyone posted.

[Pageidol]

I have a few things to share. Let me start with your dilemma.

I do not know of any of those reacting with one another. Ashwagandha, for example, is going to help regulate your cortisol levels, decrease your stress response, reset your adrenal glands and will have testosterone benefits. This is probably one of the most important herbs you're taking.

Now, with all these herbs, I'd recommend figuring out which ones to take daily and which ones to cycle. The ashwagandha is one of the ones, like pine pollen, that you take daily, especially in your condition. Some of the others you can cycle, and there are a few ways of doing it.

Cdsnuts does a multi-herb rotation, taking one of them one day and moving onto the next. But you can also partition your cycles to do like M, W, F - Tongkat Ali & Cistanche days and Tues and Thurs take herbs B and C, or D.

Or you could do your Tongkat 5 days on and 2 days off the first week to get your blood levels up, and then relinquish it to a Monday-Wednesday-Friday rotation. You'll just have to figure that out.

The idea is to keep surprising the body so you don't adapt and build a tolerance.

I recommend you read this article for more ideas on cycling:

How to Cycle Herbal Testosterone Boosters

Now, on to the next subject: Pine pollen powder.

I have always been a tincture user and have been happy. Cdsnuts and I talked through PM about the powder, which I've never tried. I have ordered two tinctures, but am waiting for them to arrive. Several months ago, a co-worker ordered a bag of the pollen but stopped taking it because she just doesn't like the taste.

Yesterday I asked if she still had it and if I could buy her bag. She ended up going and getting it on her lunch break and just gave it to me. I took 1 teaspoon and swished it around under my tongue and inside my mouth for about a minute (same principle as the tincture, and should work to some degree for androgen absorption since it's broken cell wall pine pollen from Super Man), then swallowed.

I repeated this a few hours later, and then did a whole tablespoon before bed.

I kid you not, I woke up a few times during the night, and every damn time I woke up, I had one of the best erections I've ever felt. I also awoke fully erect this morning, more so than usual.

I know the Super Man Herbs guy has a morning wood guarantee if you take enough of the powder. For me, it proved to be effective. But my tincture will be here Friday so I'm looking forward to all the nutritional benefits of the powder, combined with the concentrated androgens in the tincture.

I'll keep everyone posted.

Yeah i rekon itll be abit of trial and error within start up. Ive got pine pollen on order right now from the states, the tincture that is. Looking forward to it. Already began with the tongkat, creatine, ashwagandha. Cheers for all the great advice and regards to cd nuts!

So you were proper shut down then like me, shrunken balls, no libido, no wood...the lot?

So chuffed your right now mate!

James

[Freepressright]

Yeah i rekon itll be abit of trial and error within start up. Ive got pine pollen on order right now from the states, the tincture that is. Looking forward to it. Already began with the tongkat, creatine, ashwagandha. Cheers for all the great advice and regards to cd nuts!

So you were proper shut down then like me, shrunken balls, no libido, no wood...the lot?

So chuffed your right now mate!

James

Strange thing is that no matter what I've taken, hormones or otherwise, I've never really noticed a lot of testicular atrophy. It has always been minimal at worst, but the libido was tanked and random wood was non-existent. Genitals were literally cold to the touch. It was like the connection between my brain and my junk was broken. That's probably the best way of describing it.

I used to get sick pumps with no supplementation when lifting. During the worst period of shutdown, I got no pumps at all. Almost drove me to stop lifting.

[Cdsnuts]

I have a few things to share. Let me start with your dilemma.

I do not know of any of those reacting with one another. Ashwagandha, for example, is going to help regulate your cortisol levels, decrease your stress response, reset your adrenal glands and will have testosterone benefits. This is probably one of the most important herbs you're taking.

Now, with all these herbs, I'd recommend figuring out which ones to take daily and which ones to cycle. The ashwagandha is one of the ones, like pine pollen, that you take daily, especially in your condition. Some of the others you can cycle, and there are a few ways of doing it.

Cdsnuts does a multi-herb rotation, taking one of them one day and moving onto the next. But you can also partition your cycles to do like M, W, F - Tongkat Ali & Cistanche days and Tues and Thurs take herbs B and C, or D.

Or you could do your Tongkat 5 days on and 2 days off the first week to get your blood levels up, and then relinquish it to a Monday-Wednesday-Friday rotation. You'll just have to figure that out.

The idea is to keep surprising the body so you don't adapt and build a tolerance.

I recommend you read this article for more ideas on cycling:

How to Cycle Herbal Testosterone Boosters

Now, on to the next subject: Pine pollen powder.

I have always been a tincture user and have been happy. Cdsnuts and I talked through PM about the powder, which I've never tried. I have ordered two tinctures, but am waiting for them to arrive. Several months ago, a co-worker ordered a bag of the pollen but stopped taking it because she just doesn't like the taste.

Yesterday I asked if she still had it and if I could buy her bag. She ended up going and getting it on her lunch break and just gave it to me. I took 1 teaspoon and swished it around under my tongue and inside my mouth for about a minute (same principle as the tincture, and should work to some degree for androgen absorption since it's broken cell wall pine pollen from Super Man), then swallowed.

I repeated this a few hours later, and then did a whole tablespoon before bed.

I kid you not, I woke up a few times during the night, and every damn time I woke up, I had one of the best erections I've ever felt. I also awoke fully erect this morning, more so than usual.

I know the Super Man Herbs guy has a morning wood guarantee if you take enough of the powder. For me, it proved to be effective. But my tincture will be here Friday so I'm looking forward to all the nutritional benefits of the powder, combined with the concentrated androgens in the tincture.

I'll keep everyone posted.

There is a reason pine pollen powder is one of my favorites and one I recommend so much. This will happen without fail EVERYTIME you take it. I prefer it to the tincture because not only does it work like magic, but you're getting all of the powerhouse nutrition the pollen has to offer. Win win.

[Cdsnuts]

Now then now then. These supplements, is it do i just sort of take em spaced out through the day or smash em all at once. I feel like a walking pharmacy haha. There any chance of these reacting with one another or will it be ok just to sort off take them together, ie tongkat alongside ahrawandha?

I must be taking 10 different things as i wake up.

Cheers

CD's Natural Testosterone boosting regimen

[Freepressright]

There is a reason pine pollen powder is one of my favorites and one I recommend so much. This will happen without fail EVERYTIME you take it. I prefer it to the tincture because not only does it work like magic, but you're getting all of the powerhouse nutrition the pollen has to offer. Win win.

My tincture came in late Wednesday morning. I'm now doing both the powder AND the tincture. I am going to order more powder this weekend.

I can't wait to see what this brings. I've had MAJOR morning wood the last two mornings.

[Pageidol]

My tincture has arrived! Elvis is in the building!

Im amazed they use fenugreek in all the major so called test boosters! Your the only other guy ive come across to get into trouble off fenugreek.

Back to the saw palmetto use, id say ive read in all around 50 stories of mens negative experiences on it across different websites and forums. Id say 95% of the time, the man gets issues but then comes off it and recovers within 6 months. This seems to be the recurring theme. However then theres this 5% that seem to be royally fucked and i cant understand why.

I took sp for 21 days which did harm me and began taking the fenugreek 4 months later as a test booster which really fucked me up.

I think i didnt recover because i went mad. I started throwing down clomid and all sorts in a mad panic. Even last summer i took arimidex for a week and had full on estrogen rebound afterwards. I think the spike in e2 has been more detrimental in shutting down my hpta.

Fresspressright in all mate from once you began fenugreek use to full recovery, how long was it?
I bet you found yourself in some dark moods. This has been the most pscho damaging thing ive ever experienced.

Are you still on your recovery protocol, ie if you came off your symptons would once again emerge? I say that because im beginning to see some good signs now on these supps but id like to think that once everything is back up and running i can stop the regime and things carry on functioning as per normal.

Sweet

[Freepressright]

My tincture has arrived! Elvis is in the building!

Im amazed they use fenugreek in all the major so called test boosters! Your the only other guy ive come across to get into trouble off fenugreek.

Back to the saw palmetto use, id say ive read in all around 50 stories of mens negative experiences on it across different websites and forums. Id say 95% of the time, the man gets issues but then comes off it and recovers within 6 months. This seems to be the recurring theme. However then theres this 5% that seem to be royally fucked and i cant understand why.

I took sp for 21 days which did harm me and began taking the fenugreek 4 months later as a test booster which really fucked me up.

I think i didnt recover because i went mad. I started throwing down clomid and all sorts in a mad panic. Even last summer i took arimidex for a week and had full on estrogen rebound afterwards. I think the spike in e2 has been more detrimental in shutting down my hpta.

Fresspressright in all mate from once you began fenugreek use to full recovery, how long was it?
I bet you found yourself in some dark moods. This has been the most pscho damaging thing ive ever experienced.

Are you still on your recovery protocol, ie if you came off your symptons would once again emerge? I say that because im beginning to see some good signs now on these supps but id like to think that once everything is back up and running i can stop the regime and things carry on functioning as per normal.

Sweet

I warn people constantly that if you don't know how your body's going to react to it, avoid it. As I've said before, the consequences were gradual and got worse each time I used it. But the last time was horrible. Guessing that a 100% full recovery was 8 months, but like I said, there were milestones along the way that were encouraging.

I still run my recovery protocol because I like how I feel on it. Plus I had run R-Andro RX and figured I could use a little rebound. I haven't stopped it for long periods of time to see if there's regression. I've had only short term breaks.