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  1. #61
    Established Member Feedback Score 3 (100%) tallstraw's Avatar
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    Exemestane is a 3rd generation AI if I remember right. Truthfully, unless you're having a severe outbreak of estrogen and breast sensitivity and need letro since it's the most potent of them all to nuke estrogen and stop nip issues..everyone should be using exem, doesn't wreck your values as bad, and is a suicide inhibitor. There's no reason to use Adex now, and letro isn't needed for daily use for lethargy issues among other things.

  2. #62
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Saw Palmetto and Fenugreek...im in trouble!

    Quote Originally Posted by Swill View Post
    I'm surprised you had to use the exemestane on top of the DHT optimisation protocol man, I thought the DHT increase would take care of any aromatase? Your herbal protocol is tongkat and pine pollen is that right?... must be packing hell of a punch for you!

    The RES100 hasn't improved things with me as of yet on my herbal protocol so considering a pharma AI if nothing improves soon... you'd go extemestane over anastrozole?
    The nettle he is taking could be wiping out his DHT.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  3. #63
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Saw Palmetto and Fenugreek...im in trouble!

    Quote Originally Posted by Freepressright View Post
    You could always play with some Exemestane dosed at 25mg every other day or every three days and see if that brings about improvement.

    You'll know quickly if it improves things for you. I've actually had to incorporate some into my natural herbal protocol because I felt like I was getting an E spike. Erections became stronger within 24 hours.
    I'm surprised. You shouldn't be having any issues on the herbs unless the nettle is doing what I suspected it would.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  4. #64
    Super Moderator Feedback Score 3 (100%) BBG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cdsnuts View Post
    I'm surprised. You shouldn't be having any issues on the herbs unless the nettle is doing what I suspected it would.
    It does increase circulating DHT based on this study...

    Secoisolariciresinol, a lignan in nettle root displayed a modest inhibitory effect on DHT binding to SHBG in vitro, theoretically resulting in greater concentrations of free DHT in serum and in local tissues. The lignan 3,4-divanillyltetrahydrofuran, also present in nettle root was able to completely inhibit DHT from binding to SHBG, yet another indication that it can result in increased free (active) DHT available to tissues such as that in the scalp.

    Planta Med. 1997 Dec;63(6):529-32.
    Or at least that component of it. That's it's in a lot of test boosters like BPS Endosurge (insert product placement here lol ).
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  5. #65
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Saw Palmetto and Fenugreek...im in trouble!

    Quote Originally Posted by BBG View Post
    It does increase circulating DHT based on this study...



    Or at least that component of it. That's it's in a lot of test boosters like BPS Endosurge (insert product placement here lol ).
    Yeah, but there's also studies that shows it blocks 5ar which in turn decreases DHT. it may increase circulating DHT in the beginning when it unbinds it from Sh BG. but once 5ar is blocked it's downhill from there. Myself and other PFS guys cannot go anywhere near it because of this. We were actually discussing this in the beginning of the thread.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  6. #66
    Super Moderator Feedback Score 3 (100%) BBG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cdsnuts View Post
    Yeah, but there's also studies that shows it blocks 5ar which in turn decreases DHT. it may increase circulating DHT in the beginning when it unbinds it from Sh BG. but once 5ar is blocked it's downhill from there. Myself and other PFS guys cannot go anywhere near it because of this. We were actually discussing this in the beginning of the thread.
    I'm curious to see the studies. I do remember you guys mentioning it in the thread. I can't find a single study. I don't think I'm looking up the right keywords
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  7. #67
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBG View Post
    I'm curious to see the studies. I do remember you guys mentioning it in the thread. I can't find a single study. I don't think I'm looking up the right keywords
    To save me from digging through all of my old propecia files you can simply search "3,4-divanillyltetrahydrofuran blocks 5ar" or "Urtica dioica blocks 5ar enzyme." Etc, etc.

    Studies aside, it negatively effects me after a few days of use. I feel great in the beginning, and then the enzyme inhibition starts working it's magic on me. Then again, I'm EXTREMELY sensitive to 5ar inhibition, as are all PFS guys. Other guys are not.
    Last edited by Cdsnuts; 05-15-2015 at 04:55 PM.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  8. #68
    Super Moderator Feedback Score 3 (100%) BBG's Avatar
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    I think I remember now. I literally can't find any studies on it blocking DHT, but I do recall it blocks DHT from binding to the prostate.

    I did find this though:

    A comprehensive review on the stinging nettle effect and efficacy profiles. Part II: urticae radix.

    Only a few components of the active principle have been identified and the mechanism of action is still unclear. It seems likely that sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG), aromatase, epidermal growth factor and prostate steroid membrane receptors are involved in the anti-prostatic effect, but less likely that 5alpha-reductase or androgen receptors are involved.

    A comprehensive review on the stinging nettle effect and efficacy profiles. Part II: urticae radix. - PubMed - NCBI
    I don't mean to argue the point, more to inform, but I don't think "studies aside" should really be a phrase uttered! It may make you feel bad, but that doesn't necessarily (it could be) mean it's blocking the 5ar.
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  9. #69
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Saw Palmetto and Fenugreek...im in trouble!

    Quote Originally Posted by BBG View Post
    I think I remember now. I literally can't find any studies on it blocking DHT, but I do recall it blocks DHT from binding to the prostate.

    I did find this though:



    I don't mean to argue the point, more to inform, but I don't think "studies aside" should really be a phrase uttered! It may make you feel bad, but that doesn't necessarily (it could be) mean it's blocking the 5ar.
    Seeing as I have an intimate knowledge of what 5ar inhibition feels like, Im going to disagree. As unscientific as that sounds. ..

    And I feel I need to clarify when I say blocking DHT. When something blocks 5ar it stops the conversion of testosterone to DHT. That's what I mean when I say it blocks DHT. This is one of the reasons it is used as a test booster. Because not only does it act as an aromatase inhibitor boosting testosterone in that way but it also boosts testosterone because less testosterone is actually being converted into DHT driving up T numbers.

    Again, not all men are sensitive to 5ar inhibition. If any of the PFS guys want to take stinging nettle for a spin and then report back , I'm pretty sure they would all say it feels exactly the way propecia felt when things started to go downhill.

    You are going to make me dig into my files, aren't you? Lol
    Last edited by Cdsnuts; 05-15-2015 at 07:06 PM.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  10. #70
    Super Moderator Feedback Score 3 (100%) BBG's Avatar
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    haha! I'm sorry I don't mean to make you dig. I'm, unfortunately, a very logically minded individual (did I mention I love spreadsheets and well crafted schedule/budget software?)

    But, suffice it to say, I believe you when you say the studies exist. I do wonder if it would negatively affect someone who is otherwise healthy, ie, doesn't suffer PFS.
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