Biatch following the protocol

[jacknap]

You are similar to me, I used both fin and RU. I only used RU for a small period of time after stopping fin, but during my two year use on fin, I felt like absolute crap and it continued after quitting (after quitting I felt the same exact way as I did while on). During the short time I used RU, I felt even worse, but if I would stop I would feel better in a day or two so I don't think it is RU related, it just increased symptoms even worse. If it was strictly RU related, about any AR agonist (preg is an AR agonist) would fix it.

If you read through my posts you will see I think preg and prog both have their places and I got superior results from high dose preg originally which subsided after a couple of weeks, which I assume to be now from in increase in androgens or the lowering of estrogen.

Regarding the drugs/supplements, no I don't think you need to be on them for life or anything like that. Your body has a positive feedback mechanism so if you are increasing certain biodentical hormones, your body is going to produce more of the enzymes associated with those hormones over time. It is shown in many studies, i.e. adding in bioidentical DHT increases 5AR, adding in pregnenolone increases the enzymes associated for metabolizing preg etc.

Same reason why people have been recovering after repetitive R andro cycles, as the enzymes associated with metabolizing androsterone are all increased.

Oh and to your last question, no I don't think receptors have anything to do with it anymore (I originally did about 2 years ago)

wow thanks for that. yeahI'm 90% sure it's strictly RU related AND/OR could be NMDA receptor damage from using strong stimulants during androgen deprivation causing possible glutamate toxicity cause I didn't have enough gaba to downregulate it?

i think the nmda receptor theory might be farfetched though because even after using LSD and modafinil before the crash I had a few days of normalcy.

so approaching it as a strictly RU problem would remeron alone or pregnanalone alone or R-andro alone be enough to recover? what kinda time frame we talking running it? 30 days? 90 days? 6 months? a year? two years?

i'm looking into doing a water fast ala cdnuts as well but I'm still slim 160lbs 6' 8-14% bodyfat. Still pretty muscular squat 200, dead 320 one rep maxes

I used 1ml 50mg RU one time and got sides right away and stopped and I'm like a norwood 1 so might have just went straight through my blood brain barrier. I was losing hair like crazy though so took it as a preventative and was persuaded by it's presumed safety compared to fin.

curious what your full protocol is and other things you found pivotal besides the b3, vitamin c, caffeine

[TubZy]

wow thanks for that. yeahI'm 90% sure it's strictly RU related AND/OR could be NMDA receptor damage from using strong stimulants during androgen deprivation causing possible glutamate toxicity cause I didn't have enough gaba to downregulate it?

i think the nmda receptor theory might be farfetched though because even after using LSD and modafinil before the crash I had a few days of normalcy.

so approaching it as a strictly RU problem would remeron alone or pregnanalone alone or R-andro alone be enough to recover? what kinda time frame we talking running it? 30 days? 90 days? 6 months? a year? two years?

i'm looking into doing a water fast ala cdnuts as well but I'm still slim 160lbs 6' 8-14% bodyfat. Still pretty muscular squat 200, dead 320 one rep maxes

I used 1ml 50mg RU one time and got sides right away and stopped and I'm like a norwood 1 so might have just went straight through my blood brain barrier. I was losing hair like crazy though so took it as a preventative and was persuaded by it's presumed safety compared to fin.

curious what your full protocol is and other things you found pivotal besides the b3, vitamin c, caffeine

If you are pretty sure, pine pollen powder or R andro (androsterone) will help you the most

[Snell1234]

If you are pretty sure, pine pollen powder or R andro (androsterone) will help you the most

Tubzy do you think any of the androsterone is absorbed by our body through the powder, or we would only get it from the tincture?

[jacknap]

If you are pretty sure, pine pollen powder or R andro (androsterone) will help you the most

thanks just ordered some now. i respond to pretty much all herbs but they eventually wear off but apparently pine pollen doesn't do this?
are you familiar with nmda receptor damage/glutamate toxicity? a lot of the symptoms are similar to pfs, so i'd like to see if there's a way to ensure that isn't the case.

I've used LSD twice before in 2012, and 2016 with no problems. and modafinil in 20 times in 2016 no problems.

but those dose of lsd (120) and modafinil (200mg) 2x (different days) were really fucking weird, my anxiety shot up like crazy which I never had before. The days after though I did go back to normal. conventional doses of both for sure but my neurosteroids I don't think hit baseline yet even though it was month later. I took RU April 24th and used LSD May 23 and Modafinil can't remember exact days but something like May25th and may 28th. also the drug effects of lsd/modafinil basically wore off still as planned eg) 12 hours of LSd and 15 hour half-life of modafinil and did not feel their effects the next day...

I did notice a very mild rem sleep hit through my sleep cycle app that i use daily on my ipod. I would wake up slightly prematurely like an hour earlier. Missing like one rem sleep episode I think in retrospect. before the stims even came into the equation.

the last week before I crashed I didn't use any stims to my recollection besides coffee but it felt like a facet was slowly turning off of my androgens which would be masked by phenibut at times. on phenibut I felt basically better than normal still.

[TubZy]

Tubzy do you think any of the androsterone is absorbed by our body through the powder, or we would only get it from the tincture?

Yes, it is easily absorbed through the body any route (pine pollen powder, tincture, capsule or pure androsterone suspended in liquid like MCT oil). Every single one of those ways has worked, and you only need a few milligrams for it to be pretty effective since it can lower estrogen greatly.

[Cdsnuts]

thanks just ordered some now. i respond to pretty much all herbs but they eventually wear off but apparently pine pollen doesn't do this?
are you familiar with nmda receptor damage/glutamate toxicity? a lot of the symptoms are similar to pfs, so i'd like to see if there's a way to ensure that isn't the case.

I've used LSD twice before in 2012, and 2016 with no problems. and modafinil in 20 times in 2016 no problems.

but those dose of lsd (120) and modafinil (200mg) 2x (different days) were really fucking weird, my anxiety shot up like crazy which I never had before. The days after though I did go back to normal. conventional doses of both for sure but my neurosteroids I don't think hit baseline yet even though it was month later. I took RU April 24th and used LSD May 23 and Modafinil can't remember exact days but something like May25th and may 28th. also the drug effects of lsd/modafinil basically wore off still as planned eg) 12 hours of LSd and 15 hour half-life of modafinil and did not feel their effects the next day...

I did notice a very mild rem sleep hit through my sleep cycle app that i use daily on my ipod. I would wake up slightly prematurely like an hour earlier. Missing like one rem sleep episode I think in retrospect. before the stims even came into the equation.

the last week before I crashed I didn't use any stims to my recollection besides coffee but it felt like a facet was slowly turning off of my androgens which would be masked by phenibut at times. on phenibut I felt basically better than normal still.

If you're rotating all herbs on a 21-day cycle I can't see how they could possibly be wearing off.

Even when I was taking them weekly I never noticed this.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[Snell1234]

Yes, it is easily absorbed through the body any route (pine pollen powder, tincture, capsule or pure androsterone suspended in liquid like MCT oil). Every single one of those ways has worked, and you only need a few milligrams for it to be pretty effective since it can lower estrogen greatly.

Interesting - i always thought the gut might destroy most of the hormones in it hence why the tincture gives more of a hormonal hit.

[TubZy]

Interesting - i always thought the gut might destroy most of the hormones in it hence why the tincture gives more of a hormonal hit.

There is defintely a difference though in delivery pathways and vehicles for sure. For example, DMSO and tocopherol or saturated fatty acids are much more potent since they open up the cell. Also, taking caffeine with androsterone or any of other substance for that matter increases uptake, since caffeine opens up the cell.

The tincture is just more concentrated or at least that is what they claim, however Im kind of skeptical because they don't list how much of each hormone is actually in it so you don't really know anyways. Another reason that it could be more potent is that it contains alcohol/ethanol which can increase absorption further of pretty much any substance hence why alcohol is included in many topical products.

In my case, and others the powder seems to work just as good if not stronger.

I did hear that response before about hormones being destroyed by the gut, but never seen any solid evidence on it and even just common sense wise, there are plenty of hormones that are absorbed orally, just like DHEA, pregnenolone and even birth control (estrogen/progesterone etc.). Pregnenolone not only absorbs orally but it's absorbs extremely well orally like 80+%

[TubZy]

thanks just ordered some now. i respond to pretty much all herbs but they eventually wear off but apparently pine pollen doesn't do this?
are you familiar with nmda receptor damage/glutamate toxicity? a lot of the symptoms are similar to pfs, so i'd like to see if there's a way to ensure that isn't the case.

I've used LSD twice before in 2012, and 2016 with no problems. and modafinil in 20 times in 2016 no problems.

but those dose of lsd (120) and modafinil (200mg) 2x (different days) were really fucking weird, my anxiety shot up like crazy which I never had before. The days after though I did go back to normal. conventional doses of both for sure but my neurosteroids I don't think hit baseline yet even though it was month later. I took RU April 24th and used LSD May 23 and Modafinil can't remember exact days but something like May25th and may 28th. also the drug effects of lsd/modafinil basically wore off still as planned eg) 12 hours of LSd and 15 hour half-life of modafinil and did not feel their effects the next day...

I did notice a very mild rem sleep hit through my sleep cycle app that i use daily on my ipod. I would wake up slightly prematurely like an hour earlier. Missing like one rem sleep episode I think in retrospect. before the stims even came into the equation.

the last week before I crashed I didn't use any stims to my recollection besides coffee but it felt like a facet was slowly turning off of my androgens which would be masked by phenibut at times. on phenibut I felt basically better than normal still.

Magnesium and pregnenolone would help on the NMDA side.

However, I don't think the negative effects of LSD are from NMDA, but elevated serotonin. At low microdoses, LSD can actually beneficial at an extent (Steve Jobs did this and talks about it, even Peat talked about LSD being beneficial as well) the reason being is that at microdoses, LSD is a strong dopamine agonist. However at normal to high doses it acts as a strong serotonin agonist which is what causes the hallucinogenic effects and also stress response and bad trip.

I would focus more on getting serotonin down or blocking the receptors, which would reverse or repair a lot of the damage.

[biatch]

@TubZy:
Why haven't you already run your second R andro cycle (the first one helped you) instead of trying different experiments?....just my curiosity.