Biatch following the protocol

[biatch]

yes, I agree...just need to get used to it. Thanks.

[TubZy]

Since I reported a lot of negativity last week, (caused by panic) I would like to report that Yesterday was a "perfect day" regarding all sides, phisically, mentally, mood and sexually... So, yes, it's just a rollercoaster up and down for the moment but something is working back on the "real track of real life" and that makes me really happy and full of hope and wish to improve more and more...

You need to remember that PFS is literally an anxiety induced shit hole. Everything seems way overwhelming then it should be and trying new things sound like the scariest shit (I had this originally with caffeine, if I even thought of taking it my anxiety would sky rocket even worse, but once I had an idea of what was actually going in my body, that thought faded away and can tolerate more than I could ever now even prior to PFS), you literally need to tell yourself what is going with your body.

Once you start trying more and more stuff and seeing improvement it gets much easier once you actually understand what is going on your body. I.E. known that your GABA is severely impaired and that is causing your anxiety and know why its happening etc, that will make it much easier, instead of constantly guessing and assuming, which once again will lead to more anxiety

[Holistic]

You need to remember that PFS is literally an anxiety induced shit hole. Everything seems way overwhelming then it should be and trying new things sound like the scariest shit (I had this originally with caffeine, if I even thought of taking it my anxiety would sky rocket even worse, but once I had an idea of what was actually going in my body, that thought faded away and can tolerate more than I could ever now even prior to PFS), you literally need to tell yourself what is going with your body.

Once you start trying more and more stuff and seeing improvement it gets much easier once you actually understand what is going on your body. I.E. known that your GABA is severely impaired and that is causing your anxiety and know why its happening etc, that will make it much easier, instead of constantly guessing and assuming, which once again will lead to more anxiety

Hey Tubzy, how is your recovery going?

[biatch]

Guys, hello.
I don't know how to explaine and I don't know what has happened since 1 week, but seems like if something has tuned on... it's the whole week I am feeling wonderfull 80% of the time, energized, happy, focused, no brain fog and most of everything I am having multiple spontaneous erections coming up easily just by thinking or texting to girls.. I mean, I feel I "always" want to have sex and I have that libido and sensitivity down there I didn't experienced this clear from a long time...long time!
For sure I'm still not there and I hope things will keep moving this direction cause something seems have turned on..I hope I am not speaking too early but these days (1week) I'm touching the promised land..I remember just 8 days ago I badly crashed and I was layed in bed for 2 days with strong headace...now I am not speaking about I am 5% better, I am speaking I am "40% better" and I have no explanation how it could be that turned me on this way...Super happy at the moment and by the way I keep going the protocol (herbs,diet,cold shower,gym) and hope this is not only a short upwings.
Lets see what's next...

....one more thing, I am not tired at all and I never feel I want to sleep at night, I am not sleeping enough but I don't feel I need.
Well,.there is.one.thing I changed: I do cycle herbs as usual but I am also using high quantity of.cordyceps every day, maybe this mix gave me an extra boost.

[Cdsnuts]

Guys, hello.
I don't know how to explaine and I don't know what has happened since 1 week, but seems like if something has tuned on... it's the whole week I am feeling wonderfull 80% of the time, energized, happy, focused, no brain fog and most of everything I am having multiple spontaneous erections coming up easily just by thinking or texting to girls.. I mean, I feel I "always" want to have sex and I have that libido and sensitivity down there I didn't experienced this clear from a long time...long time!
For sure I'm still not there and I hope things will keep moving this direction cause something seems have turned on..I hope I am not speaking too early but these days (1week) I'm touching the promised land..I remember just 8 days ago I badly crashed and I was layed in bed for 2 days with strong headace...now I am not speaking about I am 5% better, I am speaking I am "40% better" and I have no explanation how it could be that turned me on this way...Super happy at the moment and by the way I keep going the protocol (herbs,diet,cold shower,gym) and hope this is not only a short upwings.
Lets see what's next...

....one more thing, I am not tired at all and I never feel I want to sleep at night, I am not sleeping enough but I don't feel I need.
Well,.there is.one.thing I changed: I do cycle herbs as usual but I am also using high quantity of.cordyceps every day, maybe this mix gave me an extra boost.

What did you think was going to happen by following the protocol?

You know exactly why you're experiencing this upswing. It's in direct relation to the work you've been putting in.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[jacknap]

You need to remember that PFS is literally an anxiety induced shit hole. Everything seems way overwhelming then it should be and trying new things sound like the scariest shit (I had this originally with caffeine, if I even thought of taking it my anxiety would sky rocket even worse, but once I had an idea of what was actually going in my body, that thought faded away and can tolerate more than I could ever now even prior to PFS), you literally need to tell yourself what is going with your body.

Once you start trying more and more stuff and seeing improvement it gets much easier once you actually understand what is going on your body. I.E. known that your GABA is severely impaired and that is causing your anxiety and know why its happening etc, that will make it much easier, instead of constantly guessing and assuming, which once again will lead to more anxiety

is it gaba or is it allopregnanalone though or both? a buddy of mine experienced a pharmaceutical recovery by using hydrocortisone + remeron. now he just uses remeron which apparently upregulated allopregnanalone

[TubZy]

is it gaba or is it allopregnanalone though or both? a buddy of mine experienced a pharmaceutical recovery by using hydrocortisone + remeron. now he just uses remeron which apparently upregulated allopregnanalone

Allopreg is a positive modulator of GABA-A so allopreg (and THDOC) are not modulating GABA as they should be, i.e. in reference to stress, anxiety, sleep etc.

The depleted neurosteroids is the source (from low 5AR I in the CNS), the GABA absence is just further down the chain.

Funny you brought up, Mirtazapine (remeron) is probably one of the last few things on my last that I haven't tried yet, it is pretty expensive. It does elevate neurosteroids pretty well and lowers adrenalin and pro thyroid, check out the links below. It is probably the only anti depressant "type" drug that I would consider trying (Peat considers it useful in certain situations, which I was surprised about) it has some similar benefits to androsterone (R-andro), but again I'm not condoning its use just like to show the research. Another member on Peat said they recovered using it.

https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...-others.15646/
https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...enaline.12425/
https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...ortisol.15626/
https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...chanism.16991/

[TubZy]

Hey Tubzy, how is your recovery going?

Very good, don't really take much these days besides caffeine (increase neurosteroids), niacinamide (increase 5AR in CNS) and vitamin C (increase neurosteroids). Have some ups and downs but overall I seem to be improving despite not really changing my regimen.

I've pretty much concluded with another member who developed a pretty well thought out theory that PFS seems to be mainly a depletion of 5AR I in the CNS most likely from a pituitary issue since many of us had severely low LH/FSH (which are pituitary hormones). Pituitary hormones positively regulate 5AR I. Since one of the pituitary hormones is oxytocin, which is definitely low in PFS people, next experiment is trying a few things that increase oxytocin which would increase 5AR I, oxytocin is highly correlated with dopamine too, which is known to be low in PFS.

Issue why increasing LH/FSH through HCG or clomid doesn't work or can temporarily help is that the downstream effects of those drugs raise androgens (T/DHT) which would then decrease 5AR I making you feel worse again, that is why it is so tricky. 5ARI and II act on inverse relationships, meaning increasing DHT directly or T, will cause 5ARII to increase but will lower 5AR I and vice versa, basically proving that the condition is stemming originally in the CNS. The reason why androsterone (R andro) helps is because its acts both in the CNS (5AR I) and serum (5AR II) meaning it acts on both enzymes even though it is claimed to just "increase" DHT. Androsterone can also positively modulate GABA-A and can serve as a precursor to allopreg.

The most common symptom I got from taking proviron/DHT gel in the past was my libido would go up and my body composition would change positively but would shoot my anxiety and mental symptoms through the roof, which makes absolute sense now since 5AR I is dropping even lower. Let me also state that prior to ever taking finasteride either proviron or DHT based things never gave me those mental "side" effects before.

Differential regulation of steroid 5alpha-reductase isozymes expression by androgens in the adult rat brain. - PubMed - NCBI


"The gene expression of 5alpha-R type 2 is under the positive control of T and DHT. The gene that codes for 5alpha-R type 1 is not constitutive, because its expression is negatively regulated by T and DHT."


High dose vitamin C increases oxytocin along with neurosteroids, another option we just found out about the probiotic L. reuteri which can greatly increase oxytocin. So hope to have some updates soon.


"The activity of the PAM enzyme system is dependent upon vitamin C (ascorbate), which is a necessary vitamin cofactor. By chance, sodium ascorbate by itself was found to stimulate the production of oxytocin from ovarian tissue over a range of concentrations in a dose-dependent manner.[21] Many of the same tissues (e.g. ovaries, testes, eyes, adrenals, placenta, thymus, pancreas) where PAM (and oxytocin by default) is found are also known to store higher concentrations of vitamin C".[22]


He presented enough evidence to make a pretty good point along with personal experiences. Most of the stuff I researched (caffeine, nicotine, niacinamide etc.) goes hand in hand with his research too.

https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...e-brain.17354/

[Snell1234]

Very good, don't really take much these days besides caffeine (increase neurosteroids), niacinamide (increase 5AR in CNS) and vitamin C (increase neurosteroids). Have some ups and downs but overall I seem to be improving despite not really changing my regimen.

I've pretty much concluded with another member who developed a pretty well thought out theory that PFS seems to be mainly a depletion of 5AR I in the CNS most likely from a pituitary issue since many of us had severely low LH/FSH (which are pituitary hormones). Pituitary hormones positively regulate 5AR I. Since one of the pituitary hormones is oxytocin, which is definitely low in PFS people, next experiment is trying a few things that increase oxytocin which would increase 5AR I, oxytocin is highly correlated with dopamine too, which is known to be low in PFS.

Issue why increasing LH/FSH through HCG or clomid doesn't work or can temporarily help is that the downstream effects of those drugs raise androgens (T/DHT) which would then decrease 5AR I making you feel worse again, that is why it is so tricky. 5ARI and II act on inverse relationships, meaning increasing DHT directly or T, will cause 5ARII to increase but will lower 5AR I and vice versa, basically proving that the condition is stemming originally in the CNS. The reason why androsterone (R andro) helps is because its acts both in the CNS (5AR I) and serum (5AR II) meaning it acts on both enzymes even though it is claimed to just "increase" DHT. Androsterone can also positively modulate GABA-A and can serve as a precursor to allopreg.

The most common symptom I got from taking proviron/DHT gel in the past was my libido would go up and my body composition would change positively but would shoot my anxiety and mental symptoms through the roof, which makes absolute sense now since 5AR I is dropping even lower. Let me also state that prior to ever taking finasteride either proviron or DHT based things never gave me those mental "side" effects before.

Differential regulation of steroid 5alpha-reductase isozymes expression by androgens in the adult rat brain. - PubMed - NCBI


"The gene expression of 5alpha-R type 2 is under the positive control of T and DHT. The gene that codes for 5alpha-R type 1 is not constitutive, because its expression is negatively regulated by T and DHT."


High dose vitamin C increases oxytocin along with neurosteroids, another option we just found out about the probiotic L. reuteri which can greatly increase oxytocin. So hope to have some updates soon.


"The activity of the PAM enzyme system is dependent upon vitamin C (ascorbate), which is a necessary vitamin cofactor. By chance, sodium ascorbate by itself was found to stimulate the production of oxytocin from ovarian tissue over a range of concentrations in a dose-dependent manner.[21] Many of the same tissues (e.g. ovaries, testes, eyes, adrenals, placenta, thymus, pancreas) where PAM (and oxytocin by default) is found are also known to store higher concentrations of vitamin C".[22]


He presented enough evidence to make a pretty good point along with personal experiences. Most of the stuff I researched (caffeine, nicotine, niacinamide etc.) goes hand in hand with his research too.

https://raypeatforum.com/community/t...e-brain.17354/

So just to flesh this out. Putting aside the method of getting recovered (we all know what to do), but focusing on what the method addresses, do we need to stop inflammation of the pituitary to allow it to return to normal function which will restore 5ar1 in the CNS?

Or do we need to do both that and then restore 5ar in the CNS through the use of androsterone?

[freefl0w]

Useful information/opinion you just shared, thank you. This is what my pfs is as well, I believe 100%. Gonna add vit C to my protocol soon, what is your dose?