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  1. #1
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 RickTheRuler's Avatar
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    Ricky’s Ride to Baseline & Beyond

    Figured I’d make one official thread for my progress. Don’t want to start any more threads & keep it all here. Officially..
    **as you all already read a few times I crashed late March, but started protocol immediately about 5 days later..Progress has been slim to none so far.. Just riding this thing out. Any upswing is more on the mental & mood side, downswings are depression, anxiety, terrible thoughts.(going through one right now) but this time it’s not as severe as my last time mentioning this where I burst into tears a few times, but still sucks. The physical things I ignore but it’s all there. I have it all.
    *As far as my sides go, if I’m being real I’m more of the worse cases of this thing, my nose got smaller & I did not notice this initially ..Weird..
    *but I’m glad that I started protocol days after. I’m just thankful I began the process. I know I could have been stuck in limbo for months & years on end, potentially causing me to quit my job or end up in the hospital or something..I got on here ASAP & been on it. So it’s all about perspective on that end.
    **There might have been extremely small improvements, maybe..I really don’t know, I really can’t tell, my downswing brain is typing this...but I’m just so level headed with this thing that I don’t really congratulate myself for any minuscule victory I have.

    My Struggles—
    Putting timelines in my head & comparing my severity of these symptoms to others & seeing how long they been on this. Example below
    - Once I saw Durantula’s older thread where he mentioned the thing about the nose shrinkage, I saw that he’s been on this for more than a year, BUT he has felt Herbs early.... So in my head I went “well guess we are gonna have this thing for 3-6 years.” Then that turns to me thinking “will I even be recovered by the time I’m 27, or 30” (I just turned 23) crazy mental game going on. Then I check out Jacknaps thread & see that he’s been having sex from the start & he’s in Good place at the year mark..I sometimes take this whole thing like A 8-10 year jail sentenced based on how bad off I am.. I sometimes ask my dad how he got through his 5 year jail sentence which is like time stopping basically.. not really an accurate comparison to this type of thing but you know what I mean..

    -Second Guessing

    This is my second struggle but I don’t let it deter me from the regimen. Why do I second guess?? Two reasons besides it just being part of the game..

    1. Money is tight so it’s tough buying organic or grass fed or wild caught...But I’ve been following the outline diet wise..I’ve been drinking organic Kefir daily bought from the store, it’s sometimes flavored (Coconut) but it has 15g added sugar. It has tons of probiotic cultures though. Again, i see people making homemeade kefir so I’m thinking that buying this from the store is not good for me. I can’t afford the organics, wild caughts, etc..*
    * I eat all the food outlined with pretty much zero regard to timing & portions.. it’s all Paleo w/ Greek yoghurt,kefir, & cheese. Haven’t cheated, haven’t strayed. Obviously won’t..

    2. I’m second guessing the way I went about my water fast back in March cause I feel nothing in regards to Herbs. Reminder I did a 21 day unsupervised fast which is not recommended. (225 lbs to 169) The fact that I did not do it at the clinic makes me believe I’ve started the whole thing wrong.. I worked while I fasted but that was it, just rested & cold showers..

    I take 3g of Pine Pollen in the morning & sometimes take 1 or 2 of the Pine Pollen capsules at night. (Along with the rotation & daily supps ) Doesn’t the fast help you become more receptive to all this?.
    * I see a lot of you feel this stuff early (which adds on to me thinking I’m gonna beat this in 4+ years, not the standard 6 months to 2.5 years) I swear I feel like I’m gonna be fighting this longer than CD did..

    -despite lifting heavy, doing 150 yd sprints 2x a week, & one day of jumping & plyometrics, I’ve been gaining weight. After my fast I was 169 lbs. I’m like 185-188 now.. I haven’t started backloading cause of this.. what’s the deal?
    * I am performing well in the gym strength wise for my state especially on Lower body lifts, im actually getting close to my pre Fin strength..It seems harder to get stronger on the upper body stuff for me, those gains come slower & I plateau more. All this despite the soft tissues from lack of DHT & less sweating etc..

    Intense exercise, cold showers, breathing exercises, & listening to Opie & Anthony radio while I work (it’s comedy) is the only thing keeping me Sane these days. I also have not ejaculated or fapped since the crash.. not that i really had the desire to though. I plan on not busting a single nut for years. It’s a goal..

    Lastly..
    Look this forum has saved me. But I read a ton of your guys progress/ideas & my head starts to spin.

    On one end I’m hearing that the outline is simple & eventually you get there with herbs, cold showers, diet, exercise, meditation, & optional prohormones.. rinse & repeat.. I’d put guys like CD & Maxout on this side of the spectrum. Even that Damn guy in a way is on this side

    On the other end, the Jacknaps of the world & others (no disrespect lol) it’s all this outside stuff that makes me lose it. A lot of people make this toooooo cutting edge which leaves the guys who try to keep it as Simple as possible & just getting through the day in a state of doubt & confusion.

    Thank you all though...& gauging where I’m at, I think September I’ll start cycling the prohormones . I thought I can get through this with herbs only, but based on my symptoms, I feel like it’s necessary. We’ll get there though..

    I get it, damn rick relax.. lol, but your input is much appreciated. At my age, with my whole life ahead of me, the days are LONG..

  2. #2
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Damn's Avatar
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    Relax…you’re Rick The Fucking Ruler, dude . But seriously, the most important thing to do is relax. I think one of the common denominators with all of us is we are over thinkers (well that, and exceptionally good looking according to Jacknap ). This only serves to rev up our stress levels and yada, yada, that’s not good. Keep it simple for now. It sounds like you have all the basics well covered. Like you said, that alone puts you above 98% of guys out there. Once those things become second nature, you’ll probably start to add other health enhancers that you hear about, or discover yourself, as you go…it can become somewhat of a hobby (or perhaps obsession is a more accurate word ). I would also caution against comparing yourself to others. Our bodies are all different and starting in different places, but given what they need, they will all heal in their own way and on their own timeline. That said, I would bet the (way, way) under on the timeframes you are throwing out. And re: second guessing…it’s all part of the overthinking (obsessive, perfectionism, etc.) thing. Just remember…perfect is the enemy of good. You’ll be just fine.
    Last edited by Damn; 07-13-2018 at 10:35 AM.
    Never lose your sense of humor

  3. #3
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    Hey bro,

    Dont worry, each body has its own way, time and so on to lead with this process, even on TRT with injection, there are guys wich respond in 6 months, others in more than 1.5 year.



    I think i will have 3 to 4 years of battle analyzing what has happened with me until now on protocol.

  4. #4
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 RickTheRuler's Avatar
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    can anyone chime in on why I haven’t been feeling very depressed & suicidal for a while?

    It’s bizzare but I actually want to embrace these downswings cause I know I’m in the right direction.

    After a couple of shitty downswings where all kinds of uncomfortable thoughts & feelings came up, it did feel like I hit some sort of new mental baseline.. I don’t even know honestly. I’m not good with going by feel so I don’t wanna make conclusions..

    Now it seems like if I’m going down it’s more of a less cheerful mood, more quiet, more lethargic.. but not that state I initially described.

    Maybe these intitial downswings was analysis paralysis?? Or was it really what it was?? I have been better mentally in very slight ways..

  5. #5
    A 1k Club Member Feedback Score 0 jacknap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickTheRuler View Post
    can anyone chime in on why I haven’t been feeling very depressed & suicidal for a while?

    It’s bizzare but I actually want to embrace these downswings cause I know I’m in the right direction.

    After a couple of shitty downswings where all kinds of uncomfortable thoughts & feelings came up, it did feel like I hit some sort of new mental baseline.. I don’t even know honestly. I’m not good with going by feel so I don’t wanna make conclusions..

    Now it seems like if I’m going down it’s more of a less cheerful mood, more quiet, more lethargic.. but not that state I initially described.

    Maybe these intitial downswings was analysis paralysis?? Or was it really what it was?? I have been better mentally in very slight ways..
    I think our dopamine and gaba systems have been severely impaired so no I don't think it's all in your but analysis paralysis probably doesn't help either. I'm extremely good at pushing my feelings down to get a job done. This shit is definitely at the chemical level.
    From rock bottom to rockstar, baby.

  6. #6
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    probably what jacknap said. i think having a micro nutrient deficiency like vit d or b might make it worse.

    last year i was super depressed for an entire month out of nowhere, not exactly suicidal, but the worst i ever experienced. im told im an optimist so it was one of the most bizarre experience of my life. i got changed my vitamin supplement qualities, started eating low glycemic and things started changing.

    if i had to really point something out, i think it was the b12 cyano i was taking that accelerated it. it can be really bad for you, so make sure you arent taking garbage b12

  7. #7
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 RickTheRuler's Avatar
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    I started protocol late March, so it seems to be the progression of things & not deficiencies cause your getting everything you need out of it. Vit D, B etc..

    I feel pretty stable right now. Obviously not 100% but none of those thoughts at all or depression...Knock on wood

    First couple of downswings were so bad, in one my old posts I wrote “why do I feel like shit all of a sudden?” .. CD told me just a typical PFS downswing. I mean I would cry during these periods..

    then it was really bad but no crying . Not as bad as the first few and so on.. to now where I can tell I’m on a downswing just based on my outlook on life and mood.

    Any physical improvement is me not being impotent anymore & having nocturnals & occasional morning wood.. I think for me to have sex I’d have to really focus & always be stimulated but I don’t plan on doing that in my recovery..

    Seems to be the progression of things.

    Still, knock on wood.

    It’s important to be consistent & even keel cause things will get worse before they get better... but also the hard thing IS accepting that you are getting better in some way & things are working..I’m always denying any little improvement I have in my head. Looking back to when I crashed in March & started protocol doing daily tasks was such a challenge. The life stopping anxiety and depression...today doing tasks is no issue, it’s an improvement, it IS..but in our heads we think that we didn’t improve in any way.. it’s the mental game that we have to conquer & shut it up..

    Like entropy said, he didn’t wake up one day and was 100%.. i think many people think that’s how it works, that you wake up and everything is all good..it never feels like we are going anywhere cause it’s a slowly increasing baseline month by month.
    Last edited by RickTheRuler; 07-24-2018 at 10:28 AM.

  8. #8
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 RickTheRuler's Avatar
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    Ricky’s Ride to Baseline & Beyond

    Whassup guys. So I just ordered the R Andro & plan on cycling next month. September 1st exactly. I still want to go on one more 21 day rotation with herbs. Still don’t see much sexually or physically but my mental is just better. I’m social, more stable, cracking jokes , enjoying music, etc..
    I haven’t been carb backloading but once I’m in cycle I’ll add that in. Should help..
    Currently while eating paleo I tested my max lifts for the first time last week, as I’ve been gaining strength super fast it’s ridiculous, I know these herbs are contributing to this big time. I just worked up to a max & left the gym. These sessions were 25 min max, no point in continuing the workout after this. I’m 183 lbs right now.

    Deadlift: 555
    Squat: 410
    Bench: 280
    In addition my performance sprinting seems to be improving slightly.

    My only 2 questions are anything else to take with the prohormones? I’m hearing things like potassium. Not worried, just on my P’s and Q’s with this thing.

    In addition, I plan on doing a mini juice feast while still taking herbs during the last week of August, my idea is I’m killing 2 birds with one stone

    1. Taking a week off from lifting, powerlifters call these deload weeks to rest your nervous system & prevent overtraining. I do it every 3-4 months.

    2. Increase receptivity to the cycle.

    ^ Let me know if I’m on to something about that mini fast or is it a stupid idea.

    Thank you all.


  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickTheRuler View Post
    Whassup guys. So I just ordered the R Andro & plan on cycling next month. September 1st exactly. I still want to go on one more 21 day rotation with herbs. Still don’t see much sexually or physically but my mental is just better. I’m social, more stable, cracking jokes , enjoying music, etc..
    I haven’t been carb backloading but once I’m in cycle I’ll add that in. Should help..
    Currently while eating paleo I tested my max lifts for the first time last week, as I’ve been gaining strength super fast it’s ridiculous, I know these herbs are contributing to this big time. I just worked up to a max & left the gym. These sessions were 25 min max, no point in continuing the workout after this. I’m 183 lbs right now.

    Deadlift: 555
    Squat: 410
    Bench: 280
    In addition my performance sprinting seems to be improving slightly.

    My only 2 questions are anything else to take with the prohormones? I’m hearing things like potassium. Not worried, just on my P’s and Q’s with this thing.

    In addition, I plan on doing a mini juice feast while still taking herbs during the last week of August, my idea is I’m killing 2 birds with one stone

    1. Taking a week off from lifting, powerlifters call these deload weeks to rest your nervous system & prevent overtraining. I do it every 3-4 months.

    2. Increase receptivity to the cycle.

    ^ Let me know if I’m on to something about that mini fast or is it a stupid idea.

    Thank you all.

    RTR, I'm new to the site, and have never cycled anything. Point is I can't answer your question, I've heard the same thing in regards to k+ and would mind hearing someone chime in on that. Also, glad it seems like you're feeling better. My worst side has been the mental crap as well, so I feel your pain. I've been cycling 7 of the herbs for the past 2 months and am waiting for my R Andro in the mail, as I type. I crashed Sept 8, 2017, didn't think it would be as bad for me as others, now here I am almost a year later...I definitely feel significantly better since starting the protocol, though. Just gonna keep at it until this crap is FAR behind me!! Keep us posted on your progress.

  10. #10
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 RickTheRuler's Avatar
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    Well, I feel terrible again. The downs really get to me.. this shall pass.

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