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  1. #1
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Maxout777's Avatar
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    Red light therapy

    Well, after watching Ben Greenfield and others rave about it for quite sometime now, Iíve taken the plunge and purchased a Joovv for my wife and I to use at our house. Seems like a great treatment for skin, inflammation, sleep, and even, yes, testosterone levels.

    Anyone have any experience running this? Will report back once I receive it, might be something worth looking at for the fellas running the protocol to get healthy again currently.
    There ain't no traffic along the extra mile.

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  2. #2
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxout777 View Post
    Well, after watching Ben Greenfield and others rave about it for quite sometime now, I’ve taken the plunge and purchased a Joovv for my wife and I to use at our house. Seems like a great treatment for skin, inflammation, sleep, and even, yes, testosterone levels.

    Anyone have any experience running this? Will report back once I receive it, might be something worth looking at for the fellas running the protocol to get healthy again currently.
    Please keep us posted. I'm curious as to what your experience will be.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  3. #3
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 Maxout777's Avatar
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    So far, I'm very impressed. This helps greatly with overall mood and how I feel. Been doing whole body (balls included) - and I can really notice a little difference in a week or so's time.

    I do it while doing Wim Hof - double benefit, following it up with a cold shower in the morning.
    There ain't no traffic along the extra mile.

    Never Quit.

  4. #4
    Established Member Feedback Score 0 jacknap's Avatar
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    actually made a post about this while back but no bites

    didn't get it but I use bright light therapy for when I first wake up
    From rock bottom to rockstar, baby.

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    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
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    I bought a Joovv a few months ago, but I need to start using it consistently every day. I think it can only help, and the testosterone boosting research looks promising.

  6. #6
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    I bought a Joovv a few months ago, but I need to start using it consistently every day. I think it can only help, and the testosterone boosting research looks promising.
    Very interesting thread. I encourage you guys to continue sharing your experiences here. I've never used one nor studied it for that matter so real world experience is priceless to share and help other people.

    My time of the year finally rolled around so I get my outside time daily. Already got a nice base going. At this rate I'll need no sunscreen come summer. Do you guys notice any coloring by using these lights or does it only use specific wave length?
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

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    SwoleSource Member Feedback Score 0
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cdsnuts View Post
    Very interesting thread. I encourage you guys to continue sharing your experiences here. I've never used one nor studied it for that matter so real world experience is priceless to share and help other people.

    My time of the year finally rolled around so I get my outside time daily. Already got a nice base going. At this rate I'll need no sunscreen come summer. Do you guys notice any coloring by using these lights or does it only use specific wave length?
    The Joovv has two wavelength options, so it wonít help maintain a tan during the winter. One is very red (one of the absolute reddest colors the human eye can see) and the other is invisible. The red light is the one that is shown to improve testosterone in the studies that Iíve read - they have done human and animal studies.

    It can be called low level laser therapy (LLLT) and other names in different studies, but itís all the same thing. (Do not get a red light from Home Depot to make your own, the heat will fry your balls. What makes the Joovv good is that it emits the right wavelength without heating your balls.)

    The red light boosted testosterone in rams, but the invisible light caused huge damage to their testicles and no test increase, although they were exposed to it more than is recommenced for humans. But since the invisible light doesnít boost test and may harm the testicles, Iíd stick with the red light.
    Low-level laser therapy to recovery testicular degeneration in rams: effects on seminal characteristics, scrotal temperature, plasma testosterone con... - PubMed - NCBI

    There was also a study done on men with genital anesthesia from post-SSRI syndrome, and in 20 sessions the red light restored an average of ~40% flaccid sensation and ~20% erect sensation. (It did not restore their orgasms or sexual pleasure.)
    Penile anesthesia in Post SSRI Sexual Dysfunction (PSSD) responds to low-power laser irradiation: A case study and hypothesis about the role of transient receptor potential (TRP) ion channels | Request PDF

    There are also studies showing that it can boost testosterone and libido in men with low testosterone, and others showing that it increases sperm counts and motility. So there is definitely something to it.

  8. #8
    Moderator Feedback Score 0 Cdsnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LetsGo View Post
    The Joovv has two wavelength options, so it won’t help maintain a tan during the winter. One is very red (one of the absolute reddest colors the human eye can see) and the other is invisible. The red light is the one that is shown to improve testosterone in the studies that I’ve read - they have done human and animal studies.

    It can be called low level laser therapy (LLLT) and other names in different studies, but it’s all the same thing. (Do not get a red light from Home Depot to make your own, the heat will fry your balls. What makes the Joovv good is that it emits the right wavelength without heating your balls.)

    The red light boosted testosterone in rams, but the invisible light caused huge damage to their testicles and no test increase, although they were exposed to it more than is recommenced for humans. But since the invisible light doesn’t boost test and may harm the testicles, I’d stick with the red light.
    Low-level laser therapy to recovery testicular degeneration in rams: effects on seminal characteristics, scrotal temperature, plasma testosterone con... - PubMed - NCBI

    There was also a study done on men with genital anesthesia from post-SSRI syndrome, and in 20 sessions the red light restored an average of ~40% flaccid sensation and ~20% erect sensation. (It did not restore their orgasms or sexual pleasure.)
    Penile anesthesia in Post SSRI Sexual Dysfunction (PSSD) responds to low-power laser irradiation: A case study and hypothesis about the role of transient receptor potential (TRP) ion channels | Request PDF

    There are also studies showing that it can boost testosterone and libido in men with low testosterone, and others showing that it increases sperm counts and motility. So there is definitely something to it.
    Awesome. Thank you.
    Total Male Optimization "People who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those that are doing it"

  9. #9
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    I've had an interest in the therapeutic potential of red/infrared light for some time, and whilst published and anecdotal evidence suggests it can be very helpful for an extremely wide variety of conditions (I've found it helpful for hair loss myself, although I know we all by now realise the relative insignificance of a few strands of keratin on our heads), I'd approach it with some caution as it's known to produce a bi-phasic response - that is to say, whilst the right dose can be healing, too much will produce no effect, or possibly even a negative effect.

    There are a lot of factors to consider when dosing - as well as the wavelength of the light and the dosage, one must also consider power, which is dictated by both the power of your device and its distance from your body (most manufacturers will provide a guide of energy density at various distances). For instance, most of what I've read suggests that a dosage of, say, 1 Joule over 2 seconds (so a power of 500mW) would not produce the same biological effect as the same dosage over 500 seconds (power of 2mW). Then add to that the confounding factor of the tissue penetration rate/depth of various wavelengths of light, none of which any of the literature I've read seems to agree upon...

    I believe the safest way to apply light therapy is, at least initially, to attempt to reproduce dosage methods that were found to be healing in studies, and then perhaps to experiment around that dose based upon your body's response. Most of the studies on mammal tissue suggests 6 joule/cm2 (at the surface - the studies tend not to consider penetration rate), generally applied at a relatively low power over several minutes, to be both safe and effective. I'd encourage anyone interested to read the studies themselves, rather than taking their information from bloggers or salespeople, as I've seen some irresponsibly high dosages suggested due to misinterpretation of the studies/dodgy mathematics - one blogger mistakenly recommends dosages as high as 707 J/cm2 of infrared light for the thyroid, when the authors of the study the blogger cited actually used only 2 J.

    That being said, an overdose of red light seems in most cases to simply be ineffective, as opposed to actively harmful, and I don't want to stop anybody from exploring a therapy that may be extremely helpful, as the true method of knowledge is experiment. Ultimately, I think red/infrared light therapy should be reserved for those who have already made some progress or recovered, and have health-barometers such as morning erections to gauge their reaction to it upon, rather than those in the lowest pits of PFS, where it's hard to gauge your bodies' response to any treatment, and who may not realise if overdoing the light therapy is holding them back.

    Edit: A link to a useful guide on calculating dosages: Complete guide to light therapy dosing - Red Light Man
    Last edited by Marquis; 3 Days Ago at 03:18 PM.

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