Transdermals

[JoeP26]

This (the below video) is what I was trying to tell everyone before they jumped down my throat and act like defensive babies. Good to know someone else out there confirms what doctors who treat PFS and gym bros who believe in PFS are saying. Transdermal Androsterone products get immediately converted to DHT where it's applied. Problem is, DHT is too dense to get past the blood brain barrier. Androsterone needs to go straight to brain for conversion and stimulation. Start looking into oral Androsterone options for PFS. It's not difficult.

WATCH: Topical Nandrolone For Hair Loss Prevention And Bodybuilding - YouTube

[Maxout777]

Why are you STILL butthurt about our interchange on here? You sound like a child, I never jumped down your throat, I just challenged the viewpoint on it. I welcome opposing viewpoints, I just like to see the proof to the pudding so to speak. Which you put some here, which is excellent.

Honestly though, you still post so negatively toward us here just for challenging you? You went to the point of posting in your thread that you were leaving a whole forum based on the interchange with two people? I mean Jesus man, I never once wanted to run you away. It makes you sound like a child to keep doing this. To be frank - no one needs your silly insults here. If you want to do that shit, head to PH. If you want to stay and have interchange and have the occasional flare up, which happens in debate - then stick around. But can we please can this shit? It’s exhausting, and we both have better things to do with our time. Agree to disagree and then get over it.

To make it perfectly clear: I'm not going to respond to anything you post again. This doesn't mean I don't want you here. Good content is always enjoyable here. All I ask is that you quit taking shots at older members just because they disagree with you. Let it go my man. Life's too short to waste time arguing on forums. I'm here to help guys and pay it forward, not waste my time bickering with you.

[JoeP26]

To make it perfectly clear: I'm not going to respond to anything you post again.

Likewise

[The Goat]

Why does it have a brain effect if it does not cross the BBB?

[Karlucchi]

This (the below video) is what I was trying to tell everyone before they jumped down my throat and act like defensive babies. Good to know someone else out there confirms what doctors who treat PFS and gym bros who believe in PFS are saying. Transdermal Androsterone products get immediately converted to DHT where it's applied. Problem is, DHT is too dense to get past the blood brain barrier. Androsterone needs to go straight to brain for conversion and stimulation. Start looking into oral Androsterone options for PFS. It's not difficult.

WATCH: Topical Nandrolone For Hair Loss Prevention And Bodybuilding - YouTube

What I got from watching that video is that a certain amount of the topical Androsterone would saturate the 5-AR at the tissue where applied and would convert to DHT like you are saying. That does not necessarily mean that ALL of it is converted to DHT before it reaches the blood stream. He talks about if applied to skin like the scrotum that has a high level of 5-AR... I wonder where on the body has a low level of 5-AR?

To summarize, oral Androsterone would likely be a better bang for your buck but to say that topical will not get Androsterone to the brain is incorrect.

[Cdsnuts]

What I got from watching that video is that a certain amount of the topical Androsterone would saturate the 5-AR at the tissue where applied and would convert to DHT like you are saying. That does not necessarily mean that ALL of it is converted to DHT before it reaches the blood stream. He talks about if applied to skin like the scrotum that has a high level of 5-AR... I wonder where on the body has a low level of 5-AR?

To summarize, oral Androsterone would likely be a better bang for your buck but to say that topical will not get Androsterone to the brain is incorrect.

Correct. But that comes with a footnote, of course.

And Joe....I haven't been around lately, which by the way is going to change today, but it seems that you are just here to try and poke holes in a tried and true way to heal.

As we all know, there are alot of moving parts to this protocol, and they are all important in their own way towards your recovery, but the most important moving part out of all of them is, MINDSET.

If you're looking for reasons why something won't work or you're trying to search for the negatives in something, you're not doing yourself any favors in moving yourself forward.

Do you know who this protocol works the best for? The guys that jump right in with both feet in full faith that they are on their way to recovery. They follow EXACTLY what is laid out for them to the tee. You know what happens? They recover.

You should be spending your precious time on looking for reasons why this protocol works. Research each thing on it's own. Myself and many, many others have gotten more then enough benefit from pro-hormones to look at this post with a chuckle. They work perfectly for what they were meant to do. No need to think about anything else.

If you want to argue against this method, this isn't the place for you. This forum, or this section rather, is for discussing the protocol that is recommended to heal. That's it. There are plenty other forums for you to argue on, if that's what you like to do.....at least that's what it seems anyway.

[delsolrob]

First, you're thinking in absolutes...there is not a 100% conversion in the skin to DHT. Yes, there are some regions of the skin that are quite rich in 5a reductase...and can cause SOME conversion to DHT (generally speaking, we want this).

what you're also not realizing is there's a conversion path from DHT to androsterone down the pathway (via 3α-HSD). So, while androsterone is converting to DHT, there is also going to be some conversion back to androsterone from dht downstream.

I appreciate people trying to learn, but these are complicated pathways and topics...you're looking through a small keyhole and calling what you see the whole picture. And making the mistake of telling everyone else what you see is the whole truth...especially when they try to tell you there's more to the picture.

Additionally, comparing oral vs transdermal - the video you showed was comparing injectable vs transdermal...you're also confusing apples and oranges again. You also make the mistake of forgetting 5a reductase also occurs in the liver. By your same logic then oral doesn't work and injection of androsterone is the only option for your purpose...not the case, but simply to demonstrate the flawed logic here.

I don't have hours to sit and post a ton of information, but wanted to chime in with some input on this topic. But, the point is that topical androsterone is quite effective

[JoeP26]

First, you're thinking in absolutes...there is not a 100% conversion in the skin to DHT. Yes, there are some regions of the skin that are quite rich in 5a reductase...and can cause SOME conversion to DHT (generally speaking, we want this).

what you're also not realizing is there's a conversion path from DHT to androsterone down the pathway (via 3α-HSD). So, while androsterone is converting to DHT, there is also going to be some conversion back to androsterone from dht downstream.

I appreciate people trying to learn, but these are complicated pathways and topics...you're looking through a small keyhole and calling what you see the whole picture. And making the mistake of telling everyone else what you see is the whole truth...especially when they try to tell you there's more to the picture.

Additionally, comparing oral vs transdermal - the video you showed was comparing injectable vs transdermal...you're also confusing apples and oranges again. You also make the mistake of forgetting 5a reductase also occurs in the liver. By your same logic then oral doesn't work and injection of androsterone is the only option for your purpose...not the case, but simply to demonstrate the flawed logic here.

I don't have hours to sit and post a ton of information, but wanted to chime in with some input on this topic. But, the point is that topical androsterone is quite effective

See this is what I was looking for to begin with. Not, "You clearly don't know how transdermals work," and that's it. As if to say, "Sit down, shut up, and stop asking questions, peasant." You all expect me to sink literal thousands of dollars into your pockets for goods to fix something that has turned my life upside down. If I or anyone else has questions, explain. It's the least you can do. Im not stupid. I can understand science talk. I'm so tired of hearing in here, "just trust the protocol," in response to anything when I've got many guys from here telling me they've been at this for a long time (4+ years) with little to no results. My confidence is shaken, therefore, that's why I ask. Not to mention the reputation this place has outside of here. In spite of that, I figured what the hell. Yes, I realize you guys are making money off of our ailments and I respect the hustle. Honestly, I do. I have no issue with it. However, if you want people to be confident in this all and to know that what is said out there is bullshit, then be transparent. Like the above. I'm not trying to be negative. I'm just really turned off by the treatment.

On another note, I will try Ultra Hard next time with this info in mind. I appreciate it.

[Cdsnuts]

See this is what I was looking for to begin with. Not, "You clearly don't know how transdermals work," and that's it. As if to say, "Sit down, shut up, and stop asking questions, peasant." You all expect me to sink literal thousands of dollars into your pockets for goods to fix something that has turned my life upside down. If I or anyone else has questions, explain. It's the least you can do. Im not stupid. I can understand science talk. I'm so tired of hearing in here, "just trust the protocol," in response to anything when I've got many guys from here telling me they've been at this for a long time (4+ years) with little to no results. My confidence is shaken, therefore, that's why I ask. Not to mention the reputation this place has outside of here. In spite of that, I figured what the hell. Yes, I realize you guys are making money off of our ailments and I respect the hustle. Honestly, I do. I have no issue with it. However, if you want people to be confident in this all and to know that what is said out there is bullshit, then be transparent. Like the above. I'm not trying to be negative. I'm just really turned off by the treatment.

On another note, I will try Ultra Hard next time with this info in mind. I appreciate it.

What reputation is that? Having the most recoveries out of any other place you can find? Believe me, if some one is here for four years and they are still having problems, THEY are the problem, that's a fact. Everything else is just unsuccessful men's usual reactions to things they can't make work for themselves. Typical behavior in regards to ANYTHING in their life that they can't get right. Blame someone else. At this point, I've been around long enough, seen enough, heard enough to confidently say this.

Nothing to argue about here....at all.

There maybe negative things said about this place by a handfull of butthurt dudes, but consider the source.....lol. C'mon now. There is also WAY more positives spoken by the hundreds of guys this place has helped. I have the testimonials and posts here to prove it. Not that I have to, or even want to. As a matter of fact, it would save me a ton of time and effort if the type of men that want to come here and have to have it proven to them that it works, just didn't bother coming here at all. I'm not trying to prove anything to anyone.

This isn't the place for them. Plenty of other places to go. I'm over it.

This is the way it works here:

You come here, read all the stickies, read all the posts, and start on the protocol. If you have pertinent questions about the specific steps, that's understandable.

In regards to the actual protocol, there is nothing to argue about. Nothing to prove. If that isn't good enough for certain people.....bye. Your life. Stay sick, stay crippled.

Everything you need to NOT be that way is here, if you want it. End of story, nothing to discuss.

[delsolrob]

See this is what I was looking for to begin with. Not, "You clearly don't know how transdermals work," and that's it. As if to say, "Sit down, shut up, and stop asking questions, peasant." You all expect me to sink literal thousands of dollars into your pockets for goods to fix something that has turned my life upside down. If I or anyone else has questions, explain. It's the least you can do. Im not stupid. I can understand science talk. I'm so tired of hearing in here, "just trust the protocol," in response to anything when I've got many guys from here telling me they've been at this for a long time (4+ years) with little to no results. My confidence is shaken, therefore, that's why I ask. Not to mention the reputation this place has outside of here. In spite of that, I figured what the hell. Yes, I realize you guys are making money off of our ailments and I respect the hustle. Honestly, I do. I have no issue with it. However, if you want people to be confident in this all and to know that what is said out there is bullshit, then be transparent. Like the above. I'm not trying to be negative. I'm just really turned off by the treatment.

On another note, I will try Ultra Hard next time with this info in mind. I appreciate it.

I'm not sure what's pointed at me and what's pointed at CD.

#1 I'm the owner of the forum and I'm the one who's financially responsible - there are no paid sponsors and I've kept this forum alive for the community here and also as a repository of information. You have never seen me do email blasts to members and you've also never seen me or any of my reps from other forums jump into topics to try to push product. Hell, I made a topical androsterone (alpha andro) and CD preferred another brands products - so that's the one he recommended to you guys...this forum was never about the $

#2 "Sit down, shut up, and stop asking questions, peasant." frankly, I find your perspective on this ironic.

I'm not sure why you took my post about transdermals personally. You make a blanket statement: transdermals don't work and you provide some useless comparisons, no data, and an example of one product that didn't seem to work well for you - Was I wrong about your expertise in transdermals? Do you think your limited use of one product made you an expert? Did I call you an idiot and berate you? NO, I made my observation of your position and lack of experience and poked at you for making a blanket statement with limited knowledge. Then outlined some concerns regarding the transdermal you were referencing and the comparisons you were making.

did you come back with any questions, explanations, etc? The only thing you came back with the snarky reply about your neuro I just exited the conversation...I don't have time for that, and it sure comes across like you think you already know it all. Plus, you're not going to listen to some "Anonymous guys on a forum"...obviously, your Neuro proved to know it all

you may benefit from asking questions rather than posting what you believe to be true - Even the first post of this thread was like "see, I was right and check this out - you are all wrong" There was a productive outcome because it provided an argument for me to discuss against. That said, it's less combative to say "hey, I saw this video and it made me question the use of topical androsterone...can someone elaborate?" there's a way of communicating that's not combative, arrogant, or pushing a false narrative...if I weren't there to follow up, the majority of guys here would have assumed your post to be valid.

I would expect the following from the members here:
Be humble, learn, share, and support your community - this a community for support!