Spring Cut Critique

[Strong_Guy]

Good luck with the cut. Transaderm is completely different when it comes to quality of application, you'll see what I mean. You will most likely end up with a decent amount 'stuck' in the bottle and if you really want it you may have to cut the bottle down the middle to get it.

I have not run 11-oxo but from what I gather at your dosage it will be great cortisol control and provide some fat loss... maybe some muscle hardness but I'm not sure as I've never run it and dosages for muscle hardening (that I've read about) tend to be at the 600mg range

Thanks for the reply. I will say transaderm is very different in terms of how quick it dries and the amount per application. It must be very concentrated for the dosage to be so small.

As far as the 11 oxo, I've heard different opinions on it, but I got a good amount fairly cheap and all I'm really looking for is the potential cortisol control benefit. Actually the whole stack is to just help mainly with muscle retention and assist with maintaining strength while consuming low calories, don't really expect much in terms of gains, maybe just a little hardness and added vascularity

[Strong_Guy]

You know, I've done about 6 cuts now, tried many different ph's, peps and aas's, I've settled on 500mg test and the same masteron when I get leaner, eca stack with weekends off, and that's it. I've gotten really really good at diet manipulation, combining longer cardio with hiit to the point where anything else I add is only a monetary cost and doesn't benefit the cut. Sure towards the end maybe something for hardening--if you are going to do a show but if not, test, cardio and diet are 98% of it

As much as I'd love to try test, unfortunately I've got to keep it to simple OTC compounds due to my profession. But I do plan on killing it with cardio, and my diet plan is pretty on point, which I agree is one of, if not the most, important factors aside from obviously a sound training regimen.

[Strong_Guy]

Also looking at what is the most effective time to dose the 11 oxo. My initial thought was to just take it at the same time as AH in the morning to get some added absorption, then I have heard where some guys take it post workout to assist further with cortisol control when it is naturally elevated (I work-out in the evening). The product I am using is LGI 11-X 75 mg/cap, which I take 4 per day. Trying to decide what may be best: take in the morning with AH, split the dose 2 caps morning / 2 caps evening post-workout, or just take the 11 oxo full dose post-workout...

[BeaverDan]

Also looking at what is the most effective time to dose the 11 oxo. My initial thought was to just take it at the same time as AH in the morning to get some added absorption, then I have heard where some guys take it post workout to assist further with cortisol control when it is naturally elevated (I work-out in the evening). The product I am using is LGI 11-X 75 mg/cap, which I take 4 per day. Trying to decide what may be best: take in the morning with AH, split the dose 2 caps morning / 2 caps evening post-workout, or just take the 11 oxo full dose post-workout...

I recommend splitting your dosage, taking half in the morning and half in the afternoon. This will keep your levels up through the day. I would split them up 8 hours apart. The half life really isn't that long.

[Strong_Guy]

I think I am going to try this. I have read where the half life is 6-8 hours on average, I was just concerned whether or not 150 mg at a time would be enough. However, my main goal with 11 oxo is to control cortisol anyway, not much in terms of gains. Also, I think the AH and Transaderm will more than cover me for muscle retention and maintaining strength during a cut. I thought about possibly taking it at once in the morning on non-workout days and splitting it on workout days, but I will probably just split it everyday to stay consistent.

[Broly]

I think I am going to try this. I have read where the half life is 6-8 hours on average, I was just concerned whether or not 150 mg at a time would be enough. However, my main goal with 11 oxo is to control cortisol anyway, not much in terms of gains. Also, I think the AH and Transaderm will more than cover me for muscle retention and maintaining strength during a cut. I thought about possibly taking it at once in the morning on non-workout days and splitting it on workout days, but I will probably just split it everyday to stay consistent.

300mg a day won't be anabolic. I'd split the dosage into 2 or 3 a day no more than 7 hours apart

[Strong_Guy]

300mg a day won't be anabolic. I'd split the dosage into 2 or 3 a day no more than 7 hours apart

Agreed. I'm going to go 2 caps for 150 mg in the morning with my AH, then another 2 caps after work. I thought about taking the second dose post-workout when cortisol may be elevated, but that would be at least 12 hours apart.

[BeaverDan]

Agreed. I'm going to go 2 caps for 150 mg in the morning with my AH, then another 2 caps after work. I thought about taking the second dose post-workout when cortisol may be elevated, but that would be at least 12 hours apart.

It won't lower cortisol immediately after each dose. I would take it preworkout.

[Strong_Guy]

Just started my 12 week spring cut cycle and here are the details:

PHs:

Transaderm 5 pumps/day (got tired of waiting for BPS)
AHv3 6 caps/day
11 oxo caps 400mg/day, split twice/day

Stats:

31 yo male, 6'00", 195 lbs., 14% bf, numerous Primordial product cycles under my belt.

Workouts are typical 3 day split (chest/tri's, back/bi's, shoulders/legs, all heaviest "working" weight I can do at a cal. deficit) with 30-45 mins/cardio moderate intensity each day post-lift, and a fourth day of 30-45 mins/cardio only. Trying to keep calories at less than 2000/day while keeping protein at least 200 grams/day all from cleanest food as possible supplemented with protein powder as needed.

I've ran this cycle before minus the 11 oxo and had great overall results (also was Dermacrine instead of Transaderm which I am also curious to see how it goes since it is my first time using it). I'm interested what the added benefits, if any, will be with adding the 11 oxo in the mix. Not a lot of experience with 11 oxo, with the exception of a bulk stack last fall that included Androenhance, which I wasn't too terribly impressed with (the Androenhance), so I thought I'd give it a shot this way during a cut.

Questions? Comments? Concerns? Any constructive input/discussion welcome!

Not going to do a full log, but will give periodic updates as often as possible, or at least a final brief review.

This was from a while back, but thought I'd give a little update. First off, this cycle worked very well for me. Through diet, training hard, and the benefits of these products I lost 15 pounds (down to 180), leaned up, and pretty well maintained my strength throughout the cycle. I've done very well over the years at gaining size and strength and decided to try for tone and definition for a change and its going well, though still a work in progress...

Unfortunately, I had to cut the cycle a little short due to some devastating health issues arising (diagnosed with ulcerative colitis). This made things extremely difficult with maintaining strength post-cycle but I trained hard, and more importantly smart, and have managed through it with little loss.

Reboot was my PCT and worked fine for this mild of a cycle, was very satisfied. Over the summer I ran a natty stack of Formasurge and HCGenerate which also worked for me fairly well. The original plan was to continue to keep calories low and keep cutting down as much as I could through the summer, but ironically with the particular issues I was having due to the UC I had to actually eat more to prevent loss of muscle and strength. I also had to dial back the training a bit until I got the other things under control. I tried to maintain my diet and keep calories at, or slightly above maintenance, though the health struggles did make it difficult at times. Currently I've stayed pretty lean and am still only at about 185, which I'm happy about with it only being about 5 pounds above where I ended in June.

Anyway, I am going to run a similar cycle this fall:

8 weeks:

AHv3 6 caps/day
11 oxo caps 750 mg split twice/day

The plan for PCT is Reboot with some DAA thrown in (since its no longer in Reboot)

Training and diet will take on pretty much the same approach as I did earlier in the year as it worked well for the time. I'm hoping to somewhat pick up where I left off and get as lean as I can. I've never dosed 11 oxo that high and I'm hoping I might actually be able to gain a little lean mass through phase two of my cut, though I don't realistically expect a whole lot. I opted out of derm for this cycle because I don't think its really necessary for what I'm looking to achieve and also want to hold onto it for future a future cycle. For the future I'm looking at possibly trying my first methyl in late winter/early spring (maybe Epi stacked with Derm, seems popular for first timers) and go for a good clean bulk starting at a low body fat % though I am a little apprehensive at this point with trying a methyl while having UC. I will have to do some (more) extensive research as to the safety and/or concerns associated with that particular situation...

[SoCal-Nutrition]

Ulcerative colitis doesn't sound like a good time...hopefully you did well with recovery!

if you don't already have the 11-OXO caps, you should check out XOsterone...new transdermal 11-OXO by MR Supps

we're also taking applications for a XOsterone Log in our sub forum too.