When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Ok I've seen so many different answers to that question on different threads and I wonder why the opinion on this varries. I'm very much a newbie to the PH world but I've ran two cycles in the last two years and while I understand they were on the mild side(AH, AD, AE, AL, etc) I had successful runs and successful PCT without the need for a SERM.
Seeing that PP is no longer an option I'm putting together a more agressive cycle(EPI, Stano, trenazone) and I've been doing a lot of reading on multiple sites and I'm seeing so many different answers. Anyone know why that is?
Oh by the way I have testforce2, SA and I'm probably going to pick up some clomid from ID
When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
20mg nolva 100mg clomid weeks 1&2
10mg nolva 50mg clomid weeks 3&4
Week 5 & maybe 6 all depend on the length of the cycle but solo either clomid 25 or nolva 10.
That being said this might be very heavy handed for you my last cycle was 18 weeks long so my pct is based off blood work and what has worked for me.
When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Quote:
Originally Posted by
burlyman30
Ultimately, this is the ONLY way to know if a PCT has been effective.
The rest of the recommendations are just guidelines that have worked for others. What will work for an individual, whether OTC or RC or Rx, will ultimately be only proven by bloodwork, not just by "feel". Someone could be "recovered", but end up with a testosterone level 100-200 points below normal. What works for 10 others may work for you also. Or may not.
The problem with SERMs... RC inconsistencies. I think many who have experienced the fluctuations in potency and quality have moved on to Rx Clomid vs. RC of anything else. Toremifene is a great SERM, even preferable to Clomid/Nolva, but only if it is actually toremifene. Plenty of RC users have found this to ring true.
In the past, I've been able to recover from a combination of OTC products even after using harsh compounds, but I found it better to plan a PCT that would extend longer than 4 weeks, as most of the OTC compounds were not as quick of a recovery (at least for me). However, as mentioned by harbonah, I confirmed things with bloodwork. It's just not worth the guessing game.
100% agree!
As stated above go with pharma over RC when you can. And get blood work each time I can personally attest to feeling recovered and having 263 ng/dl test level!< and that was on pharma grade nolva with a script.
When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
I would increase all 3 PH's to 6 weeks....or 2 weeks stano/tren then 6 weeks all 3. I like longer cycles though as you tend to keep more of the gains if your pct is on point.
Re: When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Freepressright
My rule of thumb has always been to use a SERM any time a methyl has been in the equation. PP's TRS was enough for any DHEA-based cycle I've run. I also used TRS only after an Epi/Dermacrine cycle and had no issues. But I would never again PCT without a SERM if I've taken anything methylated.
Methylation doesn't really have anything to do with shutdown. Trenazone is a good example of that. Itll shut guys down harder than a lot of methyls.
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When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Quote:
Originally Posted by
O_RYAN_007
At 6 caps/day for wk 1-4
and 9 caps for wks 5-6
and 11 caps for 7-10 of MASS V3 I hit up DJs torem protocol and TRSV2. I actually got shut down pretty good, but after about wk 2-3 I started to come back and recovered great; bones Galore! But I just went by feel... I will no longer be doing that again.
I know over on PP we talked about (I believed H2S mentioned it) how to get a pretty good deal on some blood work at a Lab Corp... Could you chime in here H2S? I'm looking to get some bloodwork at a lab corp in a couple weeks. PS, if you try and go to your DR these days and ask for a full blood panel looking for test, estriol, fsh, lh, etc, you will need to explain why you need it. IE, are you having problems??? LOL, I ran into this crap a couple months back.
ARCpoint labs are creep also I think I paid 100 for my test levels.
Re: When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Privatemdlabs.com is about 50 bucks for a whole hormone profile.
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When is a SERM needed? so many different answers
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Freepressright
That's a pretty serious dose and duration. Shutdown was pretty much inevitable.
One of the guys from AMS claimed that in many 6 to 8 week runs of their DHEA-based products they have blood work showing users only losing 25 to 50 percent of their natural testosterone in the worst cases of shutdown. I don't know the specifics, but I did read those claims.
I think of all the DHEA-based compounds, 1-DHEA is the harshest in terms of side effects. I've completely lost my sex drive, had zero energy and felt like I had the flu. I was also a raging dickhead. I don't know how it is, overall, for shutdown, but it's definitely a potent compound for being a DHEA metabolite.
I never bought into this low Suppression that is claimed by companies for their DHEA metabolites. I would love to see blood work as I have seen just DHEA have a very potent shutdown for people solo.
