Crashed from rogaine. Can I try TRT?

[Crashed]

We can play the linking studies game all day if we want to:

Minoxidil INCREASES 5 alpha-reductase activity of cultured human dermal papilla cells from balding scalp

Topical minoxidil does not act as an antiandrogen in the flank organ of the golden Syrian hamster

As one of the studies above mentions, many NOW believe the mechanism of action for Minoxidil to be its prostaglandin activity (not its potential 5AR activity) that helps with hair loss:
Prostaglandin D2 inhibits hair growth and is elevated in bald scalp of men with androgenetic alopecia

Activation of ... prostaglandin synthase-1 by minoxidil as a possible explanation for its hair growth-stimulating effect
And from this paper: Minoxidil: mechanisms of action on hair growth - PubMed

A number of in vitro effects of minoxidil have been described in monocultures of various skin and hair follicle cell types including stimulation of cell proliferation, inhibition of collagen synthesis, and stimulation of vascular endothelial growth factor and prostaglandin synthesis.

Regardless there are many men who r sufering from 'pfs' just from minoxidil. https://www.askapatient.com/viewrati...+%28FOR+MEN%29

thats only dating back from 2020, theres far more people from 2015 but the old ones get pushed down. its really tragic

[BBG]

Regardless there are many men who r sufering from 'pfs' just from minoxidil. https://www.askapatient.com/viewrati...+%28FOR+MEN%29

thats only dating back from 2020, theres far more people from 2015 but the old ones get pushed down. its really tragic

My guess is that many of these users were also prescribed Finasteride and don't realize that Finasteride is the cause of their lasting effects.

For instance:

i wish i had not taken this drug. finasteride gave me side effects but i recovered with minox its been 3wks and no change. i used to watch prn everyday but now im afraid because its difficult to have an erection. my only hope is my libido would return.

I had a similar issue with finasteride and sexual function, however after a week I was pretty much back to normal. No idea what's happened this time but im really scared that I've done damage for good this time.

Basically they stopped finasteride, but continued on minoxidil, and now attribute their long lasting PFS symptoms to minoxidil.

[Crashed]

My guess is that many of these users were also prescribed Finasteride and don't realize that Finasteride is the cause of their lasting effects.

For instance:





Basically they stopped finasteride, but continued on minoxidil, and now attribute their long lasting PFS symptoms to minoxidil.

Well i never have taken finastride in my life so that theory doesnt hold up and so have many other dudes ive spoken to who have crashed from minox

[BBG]

Well i never have taken finastride in my life so that theory doesnt hold up and so have many other dudes ive spoken to who have crashed from minox

I should clarify, I'm not saying minoxidil cannot be the cause of adverse reactions in users. I'm saying that the effects of minoxidil are almost certainly not being caused for the same reasons as Finasteride (IE, 5ar reduction).

Take the case study: TOPICAL MINOXIDIL 5% INDUCED MALE SEXUAL DYSFUNCTION

The arteriolar vasodilation induced by minoxidil activates the peripheral sympathetic nervous system (SNS) via carotid and aortic baroreceptor reflexes. In tandem with activation of the SNS, both the pulse rate and cardiac output increase (11,12). Minoxidil administration evokes an increase in plasma renin activity, largely due to activation of the SNS (13-15). The activation of the renin-angiotensin axis elicits an increase in plasma and urinary aldosterone levels (13-15). As well as, minoxidil possesses alpha-adrenoceptor agonist activity in addition to potassium-channel opening activity (16). As a part of erection biology, the peripheral nervous system helps transmit the central impulses to the end organ. Sympathetic pathways generally provide inhibitory impulses, whereas parasympathetic and somatic innervation is
pro-erectogenic, the most important component responsible for penile erection is the corpus cavernosum; smooth muscle relaxation within this tissue is the endpoint of all stimuli resulting in an erection, Alpha-adrenergic agents induce smooth muscle contraction and result in DE tumescence (17). Antagonism of alpha-adrenergic signaling
enables other independent relaxatory pathways to predominate within the penile trabecular smooth muscle (18). Allergic dermatitis which manifested by the patient as itchy and burning scalp, which is seen on examination as an erythematous and scratched scalp, leads to increase in absorption of topical minoxidil systematically. This increase
in absorption leads to low blood pressure values manifested as dizziness. Because of arteriolar vasodilatation caused by absorbed minoxidil and the direct adrenergic effect of minoxidil; sympathetic system activated. Sympathetic system activation flagged by chest tightness and racing heart also led to corpus cavernosum smooth muscle
contraction and result in DE tumescence. In the patient reported here, the absence of organic and psychological cause of erectile dysfunction, and the indirect effect on minoxidil.

Of course, for this patient, when he stopped minoxidil, the issues went away.

[LetsGo]

I should clarify, I'm not saying minoxidil cannot be the cause of adverse reactions in users. I'm saying that the effects of minoxidil are almost certainly not being caused for the same reasons as Finasteride (IE, 5ar reduction).

Take the case study: TOPICAL MINOXIDIL 5% INDUCED MALE SEXUAL DYSFUNCTION



Of course, for this patient, when he stopped minoxidil, the issues went away.

Yeah, there are also guys with PFS-type symptoms from taking things like Zoloft, Prozac, Accutane, etc and none of those things effect 5ar (or at least not in any significant way.) For minoxidil to cause PFS-type symptoms it would be, like you’re saying, through some other mechanism. Who knows what it is, though. Dutasteride and saw palmetto would probably have the exact same mechanism as finasteride because they’re all 5ar inhibitors. But ultimately the solution would be the same, whether the cause was rogaine, SSRIs, 5ar inhibitors, etc. For all of these drugs, the side effects normally go away once you stop taking them, and then for the rest of us, there’s this protocol.

[Cdsnuts]

Regardless there are many men who r sufering from 'pfs' just from minoxidil. https://www.askapatient.com/viewrati...+%28FOR+MEN%29

thats only dating back from 2020, theres far more people from 2015 but the old ones get pushed down. its really tragic

You’re right….we can play the linking studies game all day long, so what’s the point? You linked to studies saying one thing and he listed studies saying the complete opposite.

Bottom line is, Minoxidil can create pfs symptoms in certain men. Many of them are here fixing themselves.

I’m not sure why you’re arguing with them? These guys are not making this up. Their lives are ruined for the moment which is why they’re here
The last thing they need is to be told what they are going through isn’t real…..they’ve had enough of that from the medical community.

I appreciate the help, but this section is a bit different then the other sections on this forum. I’ve been running this subsection for almost five years and have seen and (helped fix) it all.

I know you have vast knowledge when it comes to gear and products of that nature. I have vast knowledge about pfs and pfs like conditions. It’s what I’ve been doing for almost a decade.

The medical community in this regards is useless, which is why their “studies” are useless as well. You can pick out any study and sure as shit you can find another scientific study contradicting the first.

[BBG]

I’m not sure why you’re arguing with them? These guys are not making this up. Their lives are ruined for the moment which is why they’re here
The last thing they need is to be told what they are going through isn’t real…..they’ve had enough of that from the medical community.

I'm not saying the symptoms are made up. I'm saying that minoxidil probably didn't cause the issue.

https://hackstasis.com/threads/minox...xpression.702/

https://hrcak.srce.hr/file/284618

Edit: nvm someone already posted it, but PFS "symptoms" aren't exclusive to finasteride. It can happen on multiple drugs/compounds for example even with deca since it also acts a synthetic progestin (from progesterone) as well which is what finasteride is made from.

Yeah, the symptoms from PFS/Finasteride aren't isolated to only finasteride. But just because two people report the same symptoms doesn't mean they need to same cure.


Take Erectile Dysfunction for example. What are some causes?
- High blood pressure
- Very low estrogen
- Low testosterone
- High prolactin
- Depression/stress/anxiety
- Drug use/abuse
- Metabolic Snydrome

None of these causes are going to solved by any one solution. The only way to know how to fix the symptom properly is to know what the actual cause of the malady is.

It not only exclusive to DHT either as finasteride lowers tons of hormones down stream than just DHT.

Yeah I addressed that in another post somewhere and so did Joe. One of the worst things Finasteride does is block Allopregnanolone and Isopregnanolone from being formed.

[Crashed]

I'm not saying the symptoms are made up. I'm saying that minoxidil probably didn't cause the issue.

what else could have caused it, when that's literally the only thing I introduced before my hormones crashed? hundreds of other men saying the same chit, never touching fin or sawpalmeto too. You dont seem to be a very flexible thinker..

[Cdsnuts]

I'm not saying the symptoms are made up. I'm saying that minoxidil probably didn't cause the issue.



Yeah, the symptoms from PFS/Finasteride aren't isolated to only finasteride. But just because two people report the same symptoms doesn't mean they need to same cure.


Take Erectile Dysfunction for example. What are some causes?
- High blood pressure
- Very low estrogen
- Low testosterone
- High prolactin
- Depression/stress/anxiety
- Drug use/abuse
- Metabolic Snydrome

None of these causes are going to solved by any one solution. The only way to know how to fix the symptom properly is to know what the actual cause of the malady is.



Yeah I addressed that in another post somewhere and so did Joe. One of the worst things Finasteride does is block Allopregnanolone and Isopregnanolone from being formed.

I've been doing this long enough to see first hand that Minoxidil causes these issues as well. And you are incorrect.....the way to fix it IS THE SAME. We've got this down to a science at this point man. You bring the body back into homeostasis and most of the problems a guy is experiencing will just simply......vanish. You can never go wrong doing the right thing for your body. By treating it holistically all systems come back online and operate as they should.

BBG...we've been tackling this here for quite sometime. Plenty of info on this forum alone to comb through.

[TubZy]

I'm not saying the symptoms are made up. I'm saying that minoxidil probably didn't cause the issue.



Yeah, the symptoms from PFS/Finasteride aren't isolated to only finasteride. But just because two people report the same symptoms doesn't mean they need to same cure.


Take Erectile Dysfunction for example. What are some causes?
- High blood pressure
- Very low estrogen
- Low testosterone
- High prolactin
- Depression/stress/anxiety
- Drug use/abuse
- Metabolic Snydrome

None of these causes are going to solved by any one solution. The only way to know how to fix the symptom properly is to know what the actual cause of the malady is.



Yeah I addressed that in another post somewhere and so did Joe. One of the worst things Finasteride does is block Allopregnanolone and Isopregnanolone from being formed.

The thing is no ones knows what the exact specific cause is and to be honest I don't think we actually ever will. The speculation is that 5ARis negatively impacts males (especially synthetic 5ARIs) and there is plenty evidence to back this up. So to look at another drug which impacts 5ARi and associate similar or the same symptoms to finasteride is pretty reasonable IMO.

The solution with herbs and prohormones is at least you are pushing yourself in the right direction to rebalance to homeostasis. We know the prohormones (androsterone/epiandrosterone) that are being cycled were lowered from finasteride. So whether you are readjusting the receptor by replacing these hormones again into your system or simply stimulating 5AR again they do seem to help.

Allopregnanolone is only a small piece of the puzzle downstream. Here are all the hormones finasteride negatively (negative sign) impacts: